Ask E. Jean (2025) Movie Script

1
Good morning. Watch your back.
Hey, guys, can you make room
for her, please? Come on, guys.
Morning.
E. Jean...
E. Jean, where's the video?
Thank you.
Thank you. Thank you.
In not coming forward earlier,
you described your failure to do so
was that the repercussions never
sounded like much fun. Yeah.
Why would you use
that particular phrase
when referring to an
alleged sexual assault?
I was talking about the
repercussions not being fun.
Being dragged
through the mud - not fun.
If you were concerned about being
dragged through the mud...
..why would you choose
to sue Donald Trump?
Because he called me a liar.
He called me a liar...
..and I couldn't let it stand.
# We follow through
anything we want to do
# Nothing ever gets in our way... #
Hi, everybody, I'm E. Jean Carroll,
contributing editor
to Esquire magazine
and advice columnist
at Elle magazine.
And this is Ask E. Jean,
the only show on television which
stands between the American public
and the total brink of hysteria.
Yes, my darlings, there's a
definite scarcity of 100% genuine
high voltage modern advice today.
Well, get down on your knees,
take your lips, and thank God
I tell people to do it.
E. Jean Carroll, you don't
really care who comments
on anything, do you?
No. Because, I mean,
you comment on everything...
Thank you, Charles.
..because I was watching, you know.
Thank you.
Thank you, honey. Do you mind
if I call you "honey"?
The creature who has any
testosterone in his body at all,
he is waiting for you to
stroke his ego, he is waiting.
He has made his decision, he tried
another woman, didn't work out.
He came running back to you.
Strong evidence that he's
in love with you.
Miss Tracey, what's going on?
Well, I'm 30 years old
and I'm not married.
Oh, boy, good for you!
Good for you! You don't
have to be married.
There's no law that says you
have to be 30 and married.
Where did you get this stuff?
We called in a woman known
for her no nonsense style.
E. Jean is going to help you.
Do you really enjoy sex?
REALLY enjoy sex?
Well, I always thought
I did until right then.
LAUGHTER
Show that other part of you,
nobody wants you to be less.
I want you to be more.
I'm live, cutie pie.
I'm live, snookie pie.
And I can tear up your
naughtiest problems by the roots,
so you call me.
This is Ask E. Jean.
Women, you are fabulous.
But for 25 years, you
have been writing to me
at the Ask E. Jean column
and, for 25 years,
no matter what problems are
driving you crazy -
your careers, your wardrobes,
your love affairs,
your religion, your children -
there comes a line
in almost every letter
when the cause of your
quagmires is revealed.
Is it possible to bash men too much?
Shouldn't I just
strip them all naked
and chase them across golf courses,
and leave lust maddened,
flogging welts all over
the whole masculine sex?
Huh?
The colossal Ask E. Jean empire
would collapse in a week,
and most romantic
problems would be solved
if I could just make women
understand one thing...
..you are precious.
I called you right after the attack.
We were not that close
to friends. I'd met you...
You didn't like me that much, right?
No, I adored you.
See, that was the thing.
I thought you were the
funniest writer I know.
And if I tell you what
happened, you will laugh.
And then I will feel great.
Yeah. And then we'll
both be happy, right?
I think, "Oh, this
is going to be fun."
Right. And you tell me
this story and I said,
"E, what happened
to you was horrible."
And you got upset
that I wasn't laughing.
Yeah.
And if you thought it was funny,
if I called you...
It would take the sting out.
That it hadn't happened,
it was just a funny thing.
And instead, I was shocked and said,
"Wow, what are we going to do?"
Ladies.
Cheers. Thank you. Thank you.
You know, I was very disappointed
that you wouldn't report him.
But, Lisa, they never would
have believed me.
I would have lost my...
I would have been fired.
I didn't have money
to get an attorney.
Everything I had worked
for would be dissipated.
You said, "Don't ever...
"..speak of this again.
"Don't ever tell anyone
this story as long as you live.
"Do I have your word?"
And you did.
And that was that.
There's no such thing as destiny,
dear listener.
We ourselves make our lives.
My first husband was
a very jolly fellow
who thought he was Ernest Hemingway.
He shot pheasant,
attended bullfights,
drank absinthe, toyed with the
idea of shooting his brains out,
and so on.
Oh, we got along famously.
I spent my days writing
the magazine articles,
quizzes, stories,
novels, movie sets,
etc, etc, which nobody buys.
This went on for 12 years.
All the time,
I'm writing, writing, writing.
And then I write this
little quiz about
Hemingway and Fitzgerald,
and Esquire buys it.
And of course, that was
the end of the marriage.
The year is 1982.
Outside Magazine plucks
me out of oblivion,
sends me to New York to
take Fran Lebowitz camping.
Fran Lebowitz leaves
Greenwich Village.
A milestone in my life,
but, frankly, was in a tent.
GUNSHOOh, I love it.
I absolutely adore it.
That was very loud.
LAUGHTER
I got one taste of New York
and I thought, "Wow!"
And I never went back
to Montana. That was it.
I rented the apartment
for 400 bucks a month
on West 26th Street.
I had no bathtub, no shower,
no kitchen.
I was as happy a being
as ever existed.
Magazines used to be written
by very famous
Hemingway, Fitzgerald,
Truman Capote, Joan Didion.
Joan Didion wrote for Life magazine.
By the way, does your audience know
what a magazine is?
Probably not.
Probably not.
This is a magazine.
This is what magazine...
Magazines are like books
with big glossy pages.
Oh, hello, mama!
This is good.
Now you can just
publish on Instagram,
or you can have your own Substack.
And it's... You get paid
from subscribers.
It's a new world,
but back in the day...
I became the sort of go-to person
at Esquire to cover bizarre
sexual gender...
..stories.
Dude, what a magazine.
I went to San Francisco to visit
the "Militant Lesbian
Pornographers".
A FABULOUS group, I've got to say.
I went on the road and moved
in with all my ex-boyfriends.
Oh, their wives hated it.
I was a made woman.
Once I was in Esquire,
then I could go on and,
you know, write for,
you know, whoever,
because I had a big clip.
Oh, my God, Frigid Women,
that's mine.
I talked to women who could not have
orgasms with intercourse.
Oh, surprise!
Playboy was ahead of its time.
I was the first
female contributing editor.
They were publishing great writers.
They paid women writers.
So what, they didn't have
their clothes on - big deal!
Get past it.
First assignment was to do
a profile of William Hurt.
And William Hurt and I went
over to the park and made out,
and I wrote about it.
Jesus.
Oh, you see this?
I went to Dartmouth
and moved into a fraternity.
Oh, my God.
When that thing ran,
oh, well, because,
you know, I had everything in it.
Everything!
I'm not a very good writer,
but I understand I have
an eccentric personality.
If I can just get that
on paper, that's it.
Chelley Kitzmiller called Playgirl
with the idea of putting a
reporter on the Love Train.
They happened to mention it to me
and I thought I was
born to do this story.
These men in these books always
have a lot of flash.
They're real glitzy
in brooding ways -
dark, but glitzy.
That's what women want.
I mean, tell me, how many men
do you know with a lot of flash?
Not very many.
The romance book is doing
exactly what James Bond did.
He turned a woman into a sex object.
We are turning men into sex objects.
But in a much more tender way.
Of course.
I think men should be
turned into sex objects.
Don't you?
This was Gonzo journalism.
Gonzo journalism is
where you arrive at an event
and you swirl the
events around yourself.
You write about how
you reacted to the story.
Hi, this is Jean.
I'm about ready to pay
you the supreme compliment.
I just got off a train for six days,
going across the country
with women in flowered hats.
And you are the first man
I called when I got to New York.
Yes.
Buckle up and lock the door.
Hunter Thompson is
on the loose again
in the frenetic,
slap-you-in-the-face style he calls
Gonzo journalism.
Hey.
Hunter came to New York often
and we would pal around,
go to Elaine's, hang
out at the strip clubs,
live sex shows and so on.
GUNFIRE
I surprised Hunter by flying to
Colorado on his birthday,
calling him and telling him
that I was writing his biography
and to come and get me.
I was at the Woody Creek Tavern.
I had personally driven in his
red Pontiac, top down.
He's smoking a grass pipe...
..and he's just done
a lot of cocaine,
and we are going 70, 80, 90mph
on the mountain roads...
..headlights off.
That's Hunter...
He lived in a state of grace.
And I learned a lot from Hunter.
The world was to him...
..something to have fun with.
The new editor in chief
of Elle magazine
had been reading these
Esquire stories,
and she invited me to lunch.
She loved the tone.
She loved the ride the wild bronco,
go for the story, never let go,
you know,
grab that bone and bury
that bone, and dig up that bone.
And she loved that.
And so then she said, "How would you
like to have an advice column?"
And at that moment,
it was like I was on the top
of the Empire State Building...
..and I jumped and I fell
into a vat of honey.
It took, zoom, off.
I was the only game in town.
That was it.
I got boxes of Ask E. Jean letters.
"Rich girl revolted
by snot hag mother."
"I'm stuck, my rut..."
Uh, uh, uh...
Oh, that's interesting.
Here's where I told
people to give up men.
Huh? It's not that great.
All my dreams were about
becoming an advice columnist.
From the age of ten...
..nightly, my father would
come home from work.
My mother had to meet the man
at the door with the cocktails,
and as they sat
and discussed the day,
I would be reading Dear Abby
or Ann Landers.
Boy, what great teachers.
Those women could write.
And they were witty
and they helped people.
And so, you know, I drank it in.
My answers did not come from me.
My answers came from
reading all those hundreds
and hundreds,
and hundreds of letters
of women writing how
they screwed up their lives.
So, when you read that all day long,
you take that and you compute,
"OK, that doesn't work,
that doesn't work."
And then I can give back
all this knowledge
that the readers gave to me.
Yes, you can stop sucking
on that dream sickle
of destiny, doll face,
because you know who's on next.
Roger Ailes gave me my own TV show.
Ask E. Jean was a live, daily,
one-hour frolic
that Entertainment Weekly called
America's Answering Machine.
I've never sugar-coated my advice.
And, ladies, it was stupendous.
So, tell me, you're married...
Right.
..and you're out of a job right now?
Yes, I get up in the morning
because I have
to take my son to school.
But after I get home,
I'm just very bored.
Right? I think, well,
if I had an education,
if I had my college degree,
I could be going places.
I could be doing something
that I really want to do.
OK, so you know what you're going
to do for yourself this Christmas?
What's that? Middletown's got
a great community college,
if I remember correctly. Yes.
You're going to be
enrolled in that thing.
You're going to put a nice
new pair of Christmas shoes on,
you're going to walk over there
and you're going to enrol.
You're going to go to college.
Why not? What's stopping you?
Go, OK?
Go.
If you ever want to know
the pulse of America,
just read advice columns,
you'll see it.
It's not necessarily in the
answers, it's in the questions.
In the 1990s, women were
coming into their own,
worried about their purpose in life.
They talked about their careers,
for God's sakes, it was great.
In the '80s and '90s,
we were quiet about that
because we were trying to,
you know, make our way in the world.
I think the world
that is 40 and younger
cannot conceive of what
it was like to work
and knowingly...
..be subject to...
..the predations of men.
But we all didn't know
how to think about this
other than it happens to women.
That's how we thought about it.
But we told each other
these stories,
like war stories that you got
when you were trying
to ascend in your career?
We wanted to be... At the table?
Yeah, to be at the table,
that was it.
There's Ask E. Jean.
Dallas, today is National Slut Day.
Happy sluts everywhere
are drinking champagne, and
unhappy sluts are writing to me.
I don't like reading any of
the advice I gave before.
I told women to suck it
up and just get on with it.
You know, that's the
Silent Generation, that's...
I was living my truth.
Oh, Jesus, I hate it when
women say that.
And I'm pleased, our final
guest, E Jean Carroll.
She's a contributing editor
to Esquire,
an advice columnist
at Elle magazine.
The press has gone to great lengths
to draw certain distinctions
between Anita Hill, on the one hand,
and Paula Jones on the other.
If you look at Anita Hill story,
she complained about
the Coke bottle, you know,
about him making lewd remarks
about pornographic films.
And if she had merely really said,
"Shut up, Clarence" -
and the same thing with Paula Jones.
She came into the room and he said,
"I love your curves".
And then, he put his hand
on her leg...
Jeez, I'll need a cold towel
in a minute here.
And I think both
the women are wimps.
I think, if they've displayed
any bravery or personal courage,
they would've dealt
with it on the spot,
and not have brought it into
the country... It's not that easy.
It's not that easy.
But, Diane, if they had...
First of all, he's a governor.
I mean, and she's...
She's a woman! She was 20...
She was 24 years old.
He was putting his hands on her...
I completely thought that
the way to get to the top -
which was, to me, the end goal.
You want to get up and you want to,
you know, get as high as you can
so you can earn as much money
as you can, because everything's...
Is... The odds are against you.
What's this one?
So, that's where my
eyes are trained.
This is sort of sad,
looking at these, actually.
It's nice to make a man happy.
It's a bad movement
to make all men happy.
It's about a time, it once was.
I remember when I saw
the New York Times story,
something about Harvey Weinstein,
I'm looking...
..and I couldn't believe it.
Not one woman.
Not two, not three, not four.
It was a watershed moment.
I mean, it was breathtaking.
The surge of #MeToo rose up
and just swallowed America.
And what happened is women started
to write to me, to ask E Jean,
should they come forward?
How can I sit there, silent?
Whoever you are, secret listener,
I know two things.
You do honour to the human species,
and you possess a list.
I'll bet yours looks
something like mine.
"I recall three instances
of being thrown to the ground..."
"I was attacked by
a military cadet..."
"Men have had the opportunity
to chase me...
"..Molested by a camp counsellor..."
"..bruise me, maul me..."
"..Propositioned by a mob guy..."
"..prick me, prod me, thump me..."
"..Chased by my boss."
This list will be called
The Most Hideous
Men Of My Life list.
I started to make a list of
the not-so-very...
The horrible men in my life.
Trump went down on the list.
I never would've written about it,
Never, never, never,
until these women came forward.
And then, I thought, "Oh, OK.
"This is how it...
This is what it does.
"This is what happens.
"You don't be quiet about it.
"You don't shut up."
There's more breaking news tonight.
In an interview published in the
latest edition of New York Magazine,
a woman claims that President Trump
assaulted her 23 years ago.
E. Jean Carroll has had the kind
of career in publishing
that a lot of young women in
journalism dream of having.
Prolifically published
with an absolutely singular,
instantly-identifiable
writing style.
People have called her
"the female Hunter S. Thompson".
Writer and Elle magazine advice
columnist E. Jean Carroll says
this happened in a dressing room
at the New York clothing store
Bergdorf Goodman, just steps
away from Trump Tower.
It was against my will.
And it hurt.
And it was a fight.
Somehow, I got my knee up
and pushed him back.
And the minute he backed up,
I was out the door.
Why didn't you call the police?
Didn't have the guts.
Didn't want to be assaulted again
with a lot of questions. Yeah.
E. Jean Carroll, thank you
very much for joining us.
Thank you for having me on.
We really, really appreciate you
sharing this very
difficult story with us.
Really appreciate it.
I went on all the shows
and told the story,
and the one question
they had for me was,
"Are you going to sue him"?
I didn't have a lawyer. I didn't
think of ever suing anybody.
OK, let's see what we got.
"Trump desperate to avoid
"E. Jean Carroll
lawsuit, lawyers say."
Good headline.
I have no idea who this woman is!
It's a false accusation,
and it's a disgrace.
People have to be careful...
..because they're playing
with very dangerous territory.
The President denied
Carroll's allegations,
saying that E. Jean Carroll
isn't his type.
"She's not my type." That is what
the President of the United States
has just said about the woman who
says he sexually assaulted her.
Which is what one says when a friend
tries to fix you up, "Not my type".
It's not what anyone really
says when accused of
what amounts to rape.
I meet a woman outside
of Bergdorf Goodman.
I took her upstairs
to a changing booth.
It was all made up.
This is all political.
When I spoke up,
I thought he would deny it,
and then say it was consensual.
But he just called me a liar.
Seeing the President,
the leader of the free world,
going on TV every single day
for three days straight,
calling me a liar -
that, I couldn't take.
My entire career, as an advice
columnist, rested on the fact
I could be trusted and not
give anybody any bullshit.
It had to be absolutely the truth.
When the President said I'm a liar,
it shook that whole foundation.
What is your name, please?
My name is Jeannie Caroll.
To Tell The Truth,
with your host, Bud Collyer!
Very well, let's meet our
next team of challengers.
Panel, these three
lovely young ladies
all claim to be Jeannie Carroll,
Miss Cheerleader, USA for 1964.
Let's start this cross-examination
with Marty Ingels.
Number one, what did you wear
when you went to that contest
and they... You beat everybody,
because you looked so terrific?
I wore a cheerleading uniform.
AUDIENCE LAUGHS
Number two, do you know the cheer
that starts off "Give 'em the Axe"?
No? We never used one like that.
Number three, do you cheer for
just football or for everything?
Everything. Do you agree
with that, number one?
How did you work up a crowd?
Not that I'm not just
a little worked up sitting here,
but I mean...
LAUGHTER
..to get a crowd with you.
How did you demonstrate that?
I didn't demonstrate it separately.
I worked it in with my cheers.
Will the real Jeanie Carroll
please stand up?
LAUGHTER AND APPLAUSE
Once upon a time,
the Indiana University Athletics
Department nominates me
in the Miss Cheerleader USA contest
in Cypress Gardens, Florida.
I have done the thing
no Indiana University football team
has ever done.
I have won a national championship.
You were Miss Cheerleader USA.
You were. Queen of all the
cheerleaders. Can you imagine?
Does that give you special access
to the All-American team that year,
the football team? It doesn't?
I get a big scholarship.
I meet President Johnson
in the Rose Garden.
Billboards, 14 feet high, all
over the state of Indiana.
They featured your advice columnist
soaring above a stunned crowd
in the Indiana University
football stadium.
And, ladies, I have never come down.
Forever in mid-leap, urging
the crowd to never lose hope.
Cheerleaders are the goddesses
of grade school,
high school and college.
So, you wanted to be a goddess
and now... Uh-huh.
And now, has that sort of
extended into
being a columnist,
being a goddess of information?
I was a cheerleader in
grade school, in high school.
And today, I open an Ask E. Jean
letter and what do I do, ladies?
I start shouting and yelling,
and cheering at the correspondent
to pick herself up and go on.
Here. Let's turn here.
Let's see how high you can kick.
Come on. Kick, kick.
Let's see. Come on.
OK. You know, the last time
I did something like this, I got...
I have to stretch my hamstring.
Let's do a little kick, Bill.
Come on, babe.
Can you kick up to my head?
Whoa!
"Carroll sued the President
after he called her a political...
"After he called her a
politically motivated liar."
That's an extremely horrible
thing to say about somebody.
"Politically..." I, who do not have
a political bone in my body -
or didn't. Now I do, of course.
Robbie!
Let me run and get my tea. Hang on!
Robbie, it's so great
to see your face!
OK, Joshua. Just let...
Hi, Rachel. Hi, E. Jean!
Robbie Kaplan.
This is the woman who won Windsor
in front of the Supreme Court,
which broke it open for all
gay couples to marry.
So, she said, "When can you meet?
"How about noon on Wednesday?"
I said, "Fine," and rode up to the
top of the Empire State Building.
And Joshua Matz laid out the case,
and they were going to give me
time to think about it. I said,
"Hell, no! Let's do it.
Let's do it."
"Bring the papers! Let me sign it."
AUTOMATED VOICE: At the tone,
please state your name.
E. Jean Carroll.
INDISTINCT VOICE ON PHONE
Trump's lawyers want
this thrown to the DOJ.
So, it's not E. Jean Carroll
against Donald Trump.
It's E. Jean Carroll against
the United States.
SHE SIGHS
We all have a lot at stake here.
This lawsuit is not just for me.
It almost has nothing to do with me.
It's for, really,
women across the country.
We have to know, if we file
a suit against a powerful man,
the Department of Justice
is not going to move in
and take the case away.
All rise.
Court is now in session.
Please be seated and come to order.
The court is sitting
en banc this morning
to hear the matter of Donald Trump
et al versus E. Jean Carroll.
Alina Habba. I represent
former President Donald Trump
in this matter.
The President is acting within
the scope of his employment
when he speaks to
the American people
to publicly defend himself
against a false accusation.
So, even in this court,
he should be immune.
Is there any situation in which
a president speaking to the press
would not be acting, in your view,
within the scope of his employment?
I think, in this particular court,
with the case law that has
been mentioned by counsel,
this was thrust upon him and he was
responding to press in his job.
My name is Joshua Matz.
I represent plaintiff appellee
E. Jean Carroll.
I think Ms Habba is mistaken
and Mr Trump was acting outside
the scope of his employment
in defaming Ms Carroll, because
he did so for personal reasons
rather than to further the
interests of the United States.
We're going to listen
to the hearing.
If the DOJ steps in and wins,
my case gets dismissed.
Well, can a president say anything
they want and be protected?
Who is he serving when he says
something like, "She's not my type"?
Is he serving the
United States of America
when he makes that statement?
Absolutely, because he
has to address the fact
that this could not and would not
have happened. He did not do it.
A White House job is not a promise
of an unlimited prerogative
to brutalise victims
of prior wrongdoing
through personally
motivated attacks.
That isn't the law.
No court has ever said it's the law,
and we would ask this court
not to make it the law.
Court stands adjourned.
Robbie. I came to tell you how
he could say you're not his type!
LAUGHTER
Oh!
What a moment. What a great morning.
The thing about E. Jean
is that, you know,
when we're representing her,
all we have to do is tell the truth.
Yeah. This is a case where
it's just so simple.
I mean, you heard
their argument today.
Donald Trump's theory remains
that he's the victim in
this circumstance. Right.
You know, and getting up and
making it as clear as day,
and that's just obviously wrong.
And he's trying to protect
legitimate victims.
Did you hear that one? Yes.
Particularly in cases
about sexual assault,
where so much yuck always
becomes involved,
it's really important that
the plaintiff be convincing
and persuasive and strong.
Come here. Oh! You know,
we all feel very lucky
and honoured to represent
you and to tell your story.
And then we go on.
And then we fight on.
And then we fight on.
Who could've guessed we'd
chug, chug, chug
and puff, puff, puff
through a New York State
Supreme Court, Federal Court,
the United States Court of
Appeals and a Federal Court?
Nobody could've guessed it. Nobody.
What do I always say at the end
of every show, honey?
What do I always say, Don?
Don, what do I always say?
Fate loves the fearless!
To my mother, I owe the richest
twist of my so-called character -
confidence.
Ah, yes. Betty McKinney Carroll,
a hot-tempered, red-headed
man-rattling, rip-roaring
Republican politician.
That woman had the
figure of Betty Grable,
the energy of a travelling acrobat
and the voice of a bird of paradise
screeching in the jungle.
I once saw her chase,
in her high heels with bows,
a large man in a car
all the way down the street
because he merely
looked like he might try
to take a parking place she
was about to manoeuvre into.
With a mother like this,
you either grow up to be a wimp
or a hard-nose who never gives up.
I grew up to be both.
I avoid all confrontations
and I joke my way through.
I'm glad that you
could drop everything,
recreating the look
you did in 1996
in Ask E. Jean.
This is the look. This is the look.
Lisa is the one who did my
hair and make-up every morning
in '94, '95, '96.
Speed ahead, 25 years.
I sue Donald Trump. We go to trial.
Who, on a jury, is going to believe
that an 80-year-old woman
is fuckable?
Nobody.
So, we called Lisa to come
and create the exact hairstyle
and make-up she made for me
every day the year it happened.
You keep me absolutely settled.
You don't seem to feel the
terror of preparing somebody
who's going to go up
against a former president.
Because I know you're going to win.
You're not a liar. Right?
Ooh! Hello, E. Jean.
Look, I'm back. You're back.
There I am. Hello, E.
Honey, you fell in love with a man,
what, four years ago? Yes.
Tell me a little about him.
Well, from the beginning,
he was really sweet.
We got along really well.
And after the first year
of us going out,
he began to be possessive.
And what happened
when you got pregnant?
Well, it got a little bit worse,
actually, at that point.
What happened?
He would come up to
my job all the time,
cause problems at work,
calling all the time.
Right. Now, those were warnings.
Every single one of
those is a warning sign.
As soon as a man
or woman says to you,
"You can't go out with your friends,
you can't go to the movie,"
you know, that's a big warning sign.
Katrina, you must take steps
so you don't live any more in fear.
Do not give him the power.
OK. He's the only one
who can make you the victim.
If you don't let him,
you're not, right? That's right.
Thank you for coming on today.
You're very brave.
The Ask E. Jean philosophy
is to stop cowering.
Do not give the other person
the power to make you the victim.
And always press charges.
Always.
How are you doing?
Joe, how are you feeling?
The civil trial against
former President Donald Trump,
accusing him of sexual
assault and defamation,
got under way in
New York City today.
Former Elle magazine columnist
E. Jean Carroll
says Trump raped her in the
dressing room of a Bergdorf Goodman
department store
nearly 30 years ago.
Carroll is suing Trump for
defamation after he called her case
a "complete con job",
said her accusation
was a hoax and a lie.
She's also making a
legal claim of battery itself
against Trump for the
reported rape itself.
Nothing compares, in
drama, to the trial.
The President issued to me 68
questions that I had to answer.
You know, every drug
I've ever taken,
every doctor I've ever seen,
every time I've ever been arrested.
Raise your right hand, please.
Do you swear to tell the truth,
the whole truth, and nothing
but the truth, so help you God?
I do. Thank you.
Good morning, Ms Carroll.
Thank you for being here.
How do you do? I'm OK.
My name is Alina Habba.
I'm sure you know that.
I represent former
President Donald Trump.
Have you ever been deposed?
Never. OK.
So, let's go over some ground rules.
First of all, you're under oath.
So, that means you must testify
truthfully and honestly,
and accurately to the
best of your ability.
Are you ready to start?
Is that a yes?
That's a yes. Giddy up! OK.
If women could see
what kind of questions
their fellow woman is asked
when she brings charges of rape
against a powerful man...
..it would stop a racehorse.
It is really quite stunning.
OK. I am going to switch
into the complaint.
Do you remember what
the temperature was outside?
Yes.
Clear and cool-ish.
I was wearing a wool dress.
And he was wearing an overcoat.
What were you wearing - other
than that jacket, that dress?
Tights, shoes.
Brassiere.
I want to say to you
and just put on the record that -
as a woman,
and although I'm an attorney -
I'm going to ask you some very
uncomfortable questions
through this deposition,
and I apologise in advance.
But how do you define "sex"?
Were you wearing underwear?
What about your
handbag from that day?
Did you wear a bra? Yes.
Let's go through your education
and your job history a little bit.
What is your highest level
of education?
Where did you go to college?
Indiana University.
And what was your first job?
Approximately how much money
were you making at that point?
What year did they stop
taking your article ideas?
Are you taking any
medications or drugs
that may impact your ability
to recall events? Zero.
Are you aware of any
physical or mental condition
that would impact your
ability to recall events? No.
Have you ever had acting classes?
SHE SCOFFS
No.
Did you ever consider coming forward
with your account prior to #MeToo?
Never.
Why not?
Because women who have been raped
are looked at in
this society as less.
Every woman who admits
to being attacked
has to answer that question -
"Why didn't you scream?
"Why didn't you come
forward when you did?
"Why didn't you come
forward before?"
And so, no, I didn't...
I didn't.
From the moment E. Jean Carroll
first sat on the witness stand
as part of her civil battery
and defamation lawsuit
against Donald Trump,
Trump's defence lawyers
have made it clear
that their strategy here is to
inject doubt and to undermine
E. Jean Carroll's account of
how Trump allegedly raped her.
Look what happens to women
in New York who report a rape.
If they've had so much as
a sip of alcohol,
the case will not be taken.
If you report a rape
and the man is actually
brought in and questioned,
the chances of him being
convicted of that rape
are 0.05.
So, that's why women
don't come forward.
That's why we're trying
to change it now.
Now, this is why we're speaking out.
OK. Let's go back to
the day at Bergdorf's.
Just walk me through when
the first time you noticed
the defendant on the
date in question was.
This is during the years I'm doing
the daily Ask E. Jean TV show.
I'm going out the revolving door
and one of New York's
most famous men
is coming in the revolving door.
He held up his hand as I was
coming out, so I stopped.
And he came in. He said,
"Hey, you're that advice lady."
I say, "Hey, you're that
real estate tycoon."
What happened after he went
through the revolving door?
"Come advise me," says the man.
"I've got to buy a present."
"Oh!" I say, charmed.
"For whom?"
"A girl," he says.
What did you say?
I was delighted.
Why were you delighted?
I'm an advice columnist.
This is my duty.
It was a New York scene
with Donald Trump asking me
to help advise him
on getting a present.
"How old are you?" says the man.
My reply is, "52."
"You're so old," he says, laughing.
And then what happened?
I said, "Handbags."
"Handbags. That would be perfect."
He was going to have
no part of the handbags.
So, I said, "Hats.
You can't go wrong with a hat."
So, we went to the hats.
It's about this point,
he looks across the store in
the direction of the escalator
and says, "Lingerie!"
How do you know that?
Because he said, "I know. Lingerie."
I want people to understand
that, in the world at large,
you were more famous than he was.
You were on TV. You had a column.
You were well-known.
We now know he just
failed upwards. Mm.
He was... He was just a guy.
He was not even
an important guy.
HE recognised YOU at the store.
"You're the advice lady."
You didn't even think
about it, though.
You said, "Go to the police."
Yeah. It wasn't because
it was Donald Trump.
Why did you even think of that?
No, but that's the important thing.
It wasn't about him.
Everybody thinks, "Oh, he's the
President. Oh, he's Donald Trump."
No, he was a man
with a bad comb-over
who hurt my friend.
At that point, did you leave
the ground floor? Yes.
So, what happens next?
On the left, there's a counter.
And there was nobody there.
And on the counter was a body suit,
see-through with a
little bit of lace on it.
He said, "Go put this on."
I said, "YOU put it on.
"It's your colour."
He threw it back at me and he said,
"Go put this on."
I tossed it back to him and said,
"It goes with your eyes."
Did he catch it?
Yeah, he caught it like this.
This was banter.
We're going back and forth.
He's saying, "Put this on."
I'm saying, "You put it on."
He says...
I thought it was...
Um...
Er...
An enjoyable repartee.
What happened next?
He said, "Let's go put this on."
And I started laughing
because I'm thinking to myself...
"This is hilarious. I'm going to
make him put it on over his pants."
That's my plan.
And then, after I make him
put it on over his pants,
I'm going to have a story
that I can tell my
friends at dinner.
Did you think Donald Trump would
put the piece of lingerie
over his pants? I did.
Did he indicate that to you?
He was very different.
He was not the former President
at the time.
He was pretty free-wheeling.
So, what happened after
he gestured, with his hand,
for you to go in the dressing room?
It's all one action.
I stepped into the room.
The door was banged, closed,
and he pushed me up against the wall
so hard that I banged my head.
Did it hurt? It jolted me.
And then he pushed me back again.
Now, I understood that it was...
This is...
This is a battle.
And he pulled down my tights.
Did you scream?
No.
Did you push him?
Yes. Where?
I had my purse in this hand,
And I tried to get my arms...
Which hand?
Right hand.
And I tried to get my arms up,
to push him back, to push him back.
The problem was,
I couldn't get my knee up
because the pantyhose
had been taken down.
And then I felt his fingers...
..rummaging around my vagina...
..and this huge weight against me.
At one point, I remember thinking,
"It's Donald Trump.
"What the heck is going on?"
And, um...
..then I felt his penis inside me.
How long did that last?
Very short time.
Approximately how long,
do you think?
I could... Very brief. It was...
Er...
Very brief.
Did you say anything?
I was so shocked, I was laughing.
Why were you laughing?
Trying to recapture
the camaraderie we had
and the sort of the feeling of
a lark - "We're on a lark.
"We're having an adventure.
This is a lark."
Trying to recapture that
and take it out of the realm
where he had entered.
Trying to reduce...
..any eroticism about it.
Was it erotic?
Not to me.
I managed to get my knee up
and push off, and get him out.
I went out the door and...
..went away.
Did you feel like he was
trying to hurt your head?
No. No.
No, he was not trying to hurt me.
He was trying to rape me.
When I came forward
about the President,
people started to
tell me their stories.
There are literally hundreds
of messages from women.
Like, you know, I'm engaging,
right now, on Twitter
with a woman whose husband
raped her repeatedly,
tried to poison their kids.
You know, that's scary.
That's a scary guy.
And then she went to the detectives
two days ago and filed charges.
In a way, it's just her telling me
her story gave her strength.
That is... That's what it's about.
I've talked to most of the
other Trump accusers,
and every single person
I've talked to
who's accused Donald Trump
of sexual assault
has been threatened violently.
Many of the women lost jobs,
lost family members over this.
So, these are all very brave women.
I am, like, the biggest
chicken of all of them, so...
You lost your job.
Oh, yeah. I lost my job.
27 years of writing the
Ask E. Jean column.
Something I loved to do.
I get up in the morning,
I loved being an advice columnist!
Loved it.
I thought they were calling to
invite me to the Christmas party.
I'm like, "Ooh, I
wonder what date it is.
"What am I going to wear?" You know?
And they say, "E. Jean, we won't be
renewing your contract this year."
And I said, "Oh, all right. Why?"
And she said, "Because
we don't have the pages."
Anybody in publishing knows
that's, like, bullshit.
A women's magazine fires a woman
for standing up to a powerful man?
Not...
As we say in the fashion world,
"Not a good look."
Boom! Elle fired me.
I crawled off the muck heap
and began writing for The Atlantic.
We drove up to Buffalo to interview
one of the Trump accusers.
Well, that made it, didn't it? OK.
I'm trying to reach
a key corroborator,
and I've been messaging
her for three days.
We're having a little bit
of a struggle
getting corroborators
to go on the record.
When you read a report that
the woman who accuses the man
has anonymous people's support,
it just...
It's weak. It's weak.
It means so much to the
believability of the story,
and also, it is armour against
the Trump Administration.
When I came forward,
my two friends who I told,
they're both journalists.
They knew... They knew the game.
You know, they're more experienced
in journalism than I am.
THEY did not want
to go on the record.
They did not want
to go on the record.
Two experienced journalists, because
those two knew what
was going to hit them.
It's been a very
emotional experience
because, from the time your story
came out in New York Magazine,
you called me about six times a day.
"So-and-so is going to
call you to fact check.
"So-and-so is going to
call you to fact check."
And I would say, "I will
fact check, but anonymously."
I remember convincing you
to come with your name.
At the end of that meal,
you had not agreed.
It was such an important decision.
I wanted to talk to
my family about it.
You wanted to talk to your family.
And they did not
want me to be public.
They did not want you
to go on the record... No.
..because you were
viciously attacked.
So, you went to your family,
you discussed it and what happened?
Then I found out you
dedicated your book to me. Oh!
Oh!
Yeah.
Yeah.
It worked.
You're my best friend.
We are best friends.
How long were you friends with
Ms Birnbach prior to the attack?
Hmm...
We met in '90, or '89.
So, four or five years.
Was she your closest
friend at the time?
No. Who was your closest
friend at the time?
Carol was, probably.
Carol Martin? Yeah.
What did you do the day
following the attack?
Well, the next day, I certainly
remember the pain in my head.
Um...
Then, went to work.
Did you tell anybody at work
what had happened?
Yes, I told Carol Martin.
We both did our shows
in the same studio.
We met backstage.
I said, "I've got to talk to you."
And she said, "Let's talk tonight."
So, we met at her house later.
It was strange because I promised
I would never tell anybody else.
The first thing I do is
see Carol Martin at work,
and I had to tell her.
And what did Ms Martin say to you?
She said, "Tell no-one."
"He's got 200 lawyers.
"He'll bury you."
The next day, I go to work.
I see you.
And... I melt!
I needed a hug.
I needed somebody to say,
"It'll be OK."
Because Lisa's like, "You're going
to the police."
Lisa's about business.
She is about... Yeah.
But I think both of our
responses were fine.
But I just remember
the first thing I said -
"Are you OK?" Because if you'd have
raised your shirt up and
you had scratches or something,
that would have been
another thing altogether,
but you seemed like you
were handling your business,
which is what I knew you to do,
but I think you were ashamed.
And... And then you
testified in the second trial.
Yeah. I never doubted for a second.
Of course Carol Martin testified!
That's what Carol Martin does.
Carol Martin stands
up for her friends.
Carol Martin doesn't let
down anybody. Of course.
She's Carol fucking Martin!
There!
They were so mean.
They were so mean.
So, I felt scarred, you know,
from that experience,
because I've never been
challenged that way,
sitting there. That's why I tell you
when you don't accept it that much,
but I don't know how you sat there
for four days or whatever it was,
straight on with that thing.
There was some darkness coming in.
There were some things I think
we confronted in that courtroom.
Listen, me and Lisa,
we know our role.
We knew that we were there in truth,
and we were there in the beginning.
Cheers, cheers.
Top it off. Yes. To Carol Martin.
Well, I'll take it. OK.
To E. Jeanie!
Whoever the fuck would have thought?
I mean, for real, for real.
You got divorced, then you
were single for a while.
Yes. Did you date?
How often did you date?
How many men did you date?
There's such a gorgeous array
of chaps. Let me think.
New York had a very
entertaining social life.
In the '60s, '70s, '80s and '90s,
the great directors,
the great musicians,
they would go to Elaine's at night.
I frequented Elaine's
on Thursday nights.
That was writers' night.
One Thursday night,
I was, as usual, at Elaine's.
I was sitting at the regulars' table
when JJ, the big-time
New York anchorman, comes in.
The night. A different rhythm,
a different pulse.
He was one of the prettiest and most
accomplished men in Manhattan.
After sundown, there are many people
who get it all and who get it on.
He pushed back his chair
at one end of the lanes,
and I pushed back my chair
at the other end of the lanes,
and we looked at one another.
Well, ladies, that was it.
It!
This is P2.
It's a blown-up version.
It was produced by your attorney.
Yes.
Here. Thank you.
That's P2.
Do you recognise yourself
in this picture?
Yes.
You have, in front of you,
a black and white photograph
that we've marked as DJT23.
I think that's her big
claim to fame.
You know, that she shook my
hand at some celebrity event.
So... So, the answer
to my question is yes.
That after you made the statement,
you became aware that
there was a photo of you
with Ms Carroll in a receiving line.
Correct?
At some point... OK.
..I saw there was a photo
on a receiving line.
Yes. OK.
When exactly was this picture taken?
I think it was when I was a
writer at Saturday Night Live.
What year was that?
When you said that Ms Carroll
was not your type
you meant that she was not
your type physically, right?
Uh...
I saw her in a picture.
I didn't know what she looked like.
And I said it, and I say it
with as much respect as I can,
but she is not my type.
Can you identify, for me, who else
is in this picture with you?
Yes, my ex-husband, John Johnson,
Ivana Trump,
and Donald Trump.
It's...
I guess her husband,
John Johnson, who...
..was an anchor...
..for ABC.
Nice guy, I thought.
I mean, I don't know him,
but I thought he was pretty
good at what he did.
I don't even know who the woman...
Let's see. I don't know who...
It's Marla.
That's Marla. Yeah, that's...
That's my wife.
Here.
Oh...
Oh, I see. Who is that? Who's this?
And the person, the woman on
the right is your then-wife, Ivana?
I don't know. This was the picture.
I assume that's John Johnson.
Is that Carroll?
Because it's very blurry.
I take it the three women
you've married are all your type?
Yeah.
So, who was your last significant
relationship that you remember?
John Johnson.
Who was the last man you
dated that you recall?
I don't remember his name.
That's how significant it was.
Yes, funky listener, freedom
is the main theme of my life.
I'm a born vagabond,
an adventurer, a fool.
And somehow I just could
never decide
to experience lasting love.
In New York, there's a taxi,
and the light is on.
It means it's available
and wants to meet people.
I didn't have that.
My light was gone.
It's not for lack of trying.
I wanted to meet people. I just...
The music had stopped.
Why do you think the
music had stopped?
Well, looking back on it...
It may have been what
happened at Bergdorf's.
That's it.
I've never had sex
with anybody ever again.
They're very happy. How do you feel?
How do you feel?
SHOUTING AND APPLAUSE
Thank you. The whole time...
You guys are so brave and
beautiful. Thank you.
Can you just give us a little room?
What do you feel?
How do you feel?
It didn't take the jury long at all
to find former
President Donald Trump liable
for sexual assault and defamation.
They awarded $5 million
in damages to the accuser.
The jury returned a total
verdict of $5 million
against Donald Trump for the assault
and Donald Trump's
lies about the assault.
Yesterday was the happiest
day of my life.
What was the feeling?
Because the former President had...
..smeared me...
..so badly that it wasn't
until yesterday I got back
up on my feet and felt,
"My name is back."
I want to know you're not going
into journalist mode. I see...
I'm going into journalist mode.
I know when you go into journalist
mode.
What would happen if you didn't have
Carol Martin and Lisa Birnbach?
You know, from the very
first moment we met,
when you told me your story,
there was a lot of evidence
that corroborated
and confirmed your story.
I was like, "OK,
that's a good case."
And honestly,
no-one else thought so.
Well, you won the case
when you showed him the photograph,
and he recognised me,
right off the bat,
as, "That's my wife." Marla.
"That's Marla."
You did look kind of similar.
At the time,
we did resemble one another.
But here's the thing.
We had to put me on the stand
and look fuckable.
Yeah. That was the problem.
How... It wasn't a problem.
The jury had no
trouble believing that.
Apparently not. And that we were...
I was very worried about that.
And you showed that picture
of me from '96 every chance.
Yeah.
With the one eating
the dumplings or whatever.
I couldn't wait for the
guy to say, "Not my type."
It's the best thing he ever said.
It... Well...
Because it... It was the capstone
of the defamatory campaign.
APPLAUSE DROWNS SPEECH
I want to ask you about
a significant verdict
that was reached yesterday.
I know this is something you
want to weigh in on as well.
This woman said I met her at the
front door of Bergdorf Goodman
which I rarely go into, other than
for a couple of charities,
and, a few minutes later, we end
up in a room, a dressing room.
What kind of a woman meets
somebody and brings them up,
and within minutes you're
playing hanky panky
in a dressing room?
OK?
Her cat was named Vagina.
The judge wasn't allowed to put
that in. All of these things...
But with her, they
can put in anything.
She's a whack job. Mr President...
LAUGHTER
When I accused Donald Trump
of sexual assault,
I had no idea what I was in for.
The avalanche of slime
has been unbelievable.
"You're full of shit.
You are not Trump's type."
Trump was attracted
to an older woman?
I doubt that. "You're
just looking for a payday."
"Show the fucking proof
of sexual abuse, you lying twat."
It raises doubt.
"Fucking piece of shit."
I've never seen somebody so happy
to have allegedly been raped.
"Fuck off and die, you nasty cut.
What a pathetic bitch you are."
"It must really suck to be you."
There is no real
consequence for this woman.
"My friend said he wants to
kill you and I cannot stop him.
"Rest in peace, cunt."
"Your address is out there."
"Liberal bitch!"
My address.
You know, at first it was,
like, hundreds a day.
Then it became thousands a day.
We were in a scary situation here.
I think of that every
morning when I wake up.
Will I make it through the day?
Every morning.
Well, now we have cameras up...
..and alarm systems.
Three days ago, we filed a proposed
amendment complaint for Carroll 1.
We sought new damages
for Trump's vile comments on CNN
and his foul rants on Truth Social.
So, the second trial was really
mostly about all the vile,
horrible, disgusting things
people have been saying
to you since then, and it was hard
for anyone to go through it.
I mean, it was just hard.
Rough. 60 or 70 a minute,
you know, "Cunt, cunt, cunt,"
you know. Oh, just...
"I'm going to rape you."
"I'm going to murder you."
Just, uh... I mean,
they're just horrific.
There's some... There's
some scary stuff out there.
As if things could not get
any worse for Trump legally,
tonight, Ms Carroll
is seeking a, quote,
"Very substantial additional amount
"of damages in response
to Donald Trump's comments on CNN."
The filing says, tonight,
that she should be awarded
these damages to,
quote, "punish Trump,
"to deter him from engaging
in further defamation
"and to deter others
from doing the same."
Would you raise your right hand,
please?
Do you swear or affirm
that the testimony
you're about to give is the truth,
the whole truth,
and nothing but the truth?
I do. Thank you.
You may proceed, Counsel.
I was looking at photos of me from
the first trial,
the second trial.
The difference is amazing.
The bags under my eyes
now are much more.
My whole face is...
I look very different
in the eight months.
You have two lawsuits
against former President Donald
Trump, is that correct?
Yes.
It really had a toll.
It really had a toll.
We were prepping
for the second trial
and giving testimony,
and Robbie...
..very smartly...
said, "The man you have not seen
"in 30 years is going
to be in that courtroom."
I just had a total breakdown.
I couldn't talk.
I lost my language.
Nothing came into my brain.
And I'm feeling...
..the load is coming down on me to
such an extent
that I didn't think I
would ever talk again,
or ever leave that room or...
OK. You mentioned that
you worked hard
to push the memories
away with respect to
the alleged incident
with Donald Trump.
How have you worked to
push the memories away?
It's...
..an ongoing...
..project.
It's an underlying...
..theme...
..of my life. It...
A vision or a...
A word or a...
An image,
or a piece of tape,
or just a flash...
..of a photo will
occur in my mind...
..and I will bat it away.
And if it comes back, I...
I have to consciously shove it away.
How many instances can you recall
where this has happened?
It...
It's difficult to describe.
It's like an underlying
condition of my life.
So, as you sit here today,
you can't describe to me
what that was,
what you were thinking about?
Objection to form. You can answer.
I can...
..describe to you AN episode.
Sure. Let's start there.
It was
October 7th, 2016.
My brothers and sisters and I
were gathered at my
mother's deathbed...
..and it was a very joyful time
because we were recalling
the highlights of my mother's life,
and she was enjoying herself,
watching home movies.
And our phones went off,
the TV went off,
and the Access Hollywood tape hit.
Use some Tic Tacs just
in case I start kissing her.
My brain was taken over
with images of
Donald Trump...
..pressing his mouth against mine.
Donald Trump pushing me.
Donald Trump raping me
in the dressing room.
I haven't gotten an answer.
I've gotten a lot of testimony,
but not much of an answer.
What is the image?
You said it's sometimes
a photograph.
What's the photograph of?
The image of being
downstairs looking at hats.
An image of riding an escalator.
Going into the dressing room.
That right there...
The going into the dressing room
is one of the worst.
Why is it one of the worst?
When that image comes up
I feel like just an idiot.
And then I feel bad...
..because I wasn't thinking.
I felt guilty because
I should have seen a sign.
I felt guilty
as a bad example to women.
I felt guilty because I went into
the dressing room,
guilty that I was being a bad...
I wasn't smart,
so I was... I felt guilty.
I still feel guilty.
Why do you still feel guilty?
I know I'm not supposed
to feel this way,
but I feel it's my fault.
One minute, you're a daisy
fresh, smart aleck,
boisterous, bold, reckless,
heedless girl
with remarkable reserves of power.
And ten minutes later,
after you've been
pulled into an alley,
pushed down into a back seat,
thrown to the ground,
you're a damaged
package of female fears.
Susan, I admire you more than I can
say for coming on today, honey.
Now, I don't want
to get into the rape
because, you know, I just...
I just can't handle it today.
What I want to hear is
what happened to you afterwards.
After the rape.
Actually, during the rape,
I said to him,
why are you doing this?
And he said, I had no right
to complain about any of
it because it was all my fault.
E. JEAN GASPS
And you believed it?
You believed it?
Totally believed it.
What is it about you growing up
and being this wonderful girl,
so powerful, so
unafraid of everything -
why, suddenly, just in this,
this five minutes
of this horrible thing,
why did you think it was your fault?
I don't know,
I just, you know,
I thought I could have
did something.
You know, I thought maybe
I didn't make it clear enough.
So, you decided not to prosecute?
Right.
My darlings, the woman who best
survives a rape
is a woman who doesn't perpetuate
and worsen her misery
by adding guilt to it.
You can see I'm struggling
through this.
It's very hard for me.
So call. We're live, sweetie pie,
1-800-988-Talk.
Did you ever seek professional
help in your entire life?
No.
It... To dwell on something
that is horrendous...
..makes the period that you're
dwelling on it also horrendous.
I just don't like the dwelling
and the talking about, um...
I was born in 1943.
We are the chin-up, move-it-on,
grin-and-bear-it generation.
We didn't complain.
It would never occur to me.
We actually smiled
about it and moved on.
That's how we handle things.
Yes, my darling doodle bangers.
Here's the Ask E. Jean control room.
Hi, Cheryl. Hi.
Who are you talking to,
Cheryl? I don't know. Who's this?
Sarah runs the chyron.
The chyron are the words that come
in under the pictures. Hi.
And look here.
Renata is in charge of this show.
Hello. Oh. Looky here. What is...?
Oh! These are our guests.
Oh. They're horrified.
Maybe... I can't hear you,
Renata. I can't...
Get into the studio, please.
We have a show to do. Come on.
We have people on the phone.
All right. Get in the studio.
Do the show.
Our beautiful cameraman.
Hi, Renata.
Hi, Jean. Honey, I'm so glad that
our audience got to see you at last.
Honey, honey. What?
We have Pete on the phone.
Oh, Pete. Pete, honey,
are you there?
Did you ever speak
to your general practitioner about
the fact that you had no sex drive?
I did have a sex drive.
I always liked sex.
Sex is one of the great,
delicious things. I had...
..shut down...
..the pathway...
..to meeting a partner.
I wish perhaps I had seen
a therapist,
but I didn't,
and I'm now grappling
with things that may have...
..actually have hurt me.
And I'm getting a new view of life.
For years, I thought of myself
as an invincible old lady,
and if I've learned anything is
I have to start admitting...
..that I have suffered.
But you didn't stay away
from writing
about it to the general public,
is that correct?
That's my form of therapy. I write.
The second civil trial between
Donald Trump
and writer E. Jean Carroll
is under way.
The former President appeared
in court earlier today.
This trial is just about damages.
All the jury is deciding
is how much more he owes
E. Jean Carroll
In addition to the $5 million she's
already been awarded
at that first trial.
He didn't even come
to the first trial
because that was
only about sexual assault.
He didn't care about that.
But this trial was about money -
and, boy, did he show up.
Throughout the trial,
Trump continued
to deny Carroll's allegations
against him,
prompting a wave of criticism
and threats against the writer.
Trump's attorney, Alina Habba,
arguing Trump could not control
what people wrote online,
and that Carroll had actually been
elevated
because of Trump's statements.
Ms Carroll,
do you think this trial
is inadvertently helping
Trump's political campaign?
It was terrible.
I had to stand up,
walk to the witness box,
turn around, hold up my hand...
..and swear I was going to
tell the truth.
And there's Donald Trump
sitting 35 feet away from me.
I was afraid I
wouldn't be able to talk
because that's what
happened to me in prep.
I just thought I was in deep shit.
Deep.
I was like this.
It was horrible.
And that was the moment.
Robbie Kaplan was sitting here.
She took me by the little hand
and she said,
"Good morning, Ms Carroll.
"Can you please spell
your name for the jury?"
And I don't know what happened.
I looked out. There he was.
And he was exactly zero.
He did not exist.
One of the things
that kept being hammered over
and over again by Shawn Crowley,
the lawyer for E. Jean Carroll,
who delivered that statement,
is that she wanted the jury
to consider when they are
thinking about punitive damages,
how much will it
take to make it stop?
Because as recently as this
morning, Ms Crowley noted,
Donald Trump had defamed
her client again.
We return.
We went to the court
and the judge said,
"The jury has a verdict."
And that's...
Boy, that's when you have
to stand there and take it.
It was up in the air.
I've got Robbie on this side
and Shawn on this side.
Our hands are...
..squeezing each other,
and the forewoman read out...
..the verdict.
The big story on Action News
tonight is breaking news.
A verdict has been reached
in the defamation
damages trial against
former President Donald Trump.
What we just witnessed
right behind us
as she left with her legal team
is that she is elated.
Former President ordered to pay
$83.3 million in damages.
Money, money, money, money.
$83 million to stop Mr Trump
from getting in front of cameras,
from making posts on Truth
Social,
as it relates to
Ms E. Jean Carroll at all.
If he had just shut his mouth...
Yep.
..he'd have been
dealing with $5 million.
For perspective, OJ Simpson
only had to pay $33 million
for a double murder.
This win for E. Jean Carroll
marked a momentous day
for victims of
sexual abuse everywhere.
Trump will, for the first time,
face legal accountability
for his treatment of women.
We're fighting
not really, Rachel, for me.
It's now about fighting
for all women.
Women are fighters.
Bad things still happen to women.
Yeah.
But women are no longer damsels.
Great.
Wow. You've been on camera.
You're a pro.
Give me a big smile. Yes.
The 10,000-year-old damsel
in distress story is dead.
It's not the '50s any more, boys.
"Dear Ms Carroll, thank you
for standing up to Trump.
"I am your age, and this means a lot
"to our generation,
"which endured abuse silently."
"Congratulations on the success.
"You have gained a
victory for all women.
"Please let me know
if there are steps
"that I and others can take
to continue your wonderful efforts."
There's the crux.
There is the crux.
That is what we're facing right now.
We have to realise
that this win has to go on.
After the win, it has
just taken weeks and weeks
to get back to my human beingness...
..which completely flew the coop.
I don't know where my
human beingness was
because I was an entity.
I was a thing that won $83 million.
I don't know what that is.
What the...?
You see how I live.
I am thinking of getting a toaster.
Oh, my God.
God!
Oh, hello.
This looks really good.
Wow. Oh, my God, that's insane.
We look like we're...
Yes. Oh! Oh, my God, look at you.
We look just like we called
each other and matched.
The trial was a very big deal.
In a dark moment
when people in America
are shredding their nerves
in the darkness of what's going on.
And here comes this huge attorney
called Robbie Kaplan,
who stands five foot one.
A giant who beats
Donald Trump twice,
then makes him pay,
yes, $83 million.
So, how are you feeling?
I feel fabulous.
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE
I feel very, very lucky.
I'm overwhelmed every day
with happiness.
Just for being alive.
Swear to God.
What's your best advice
for women coming forward
with their stories?
It's a very, very difficult
decision to make.
Overpowering because
I'm just a woman.
I am just an old woman.
I... It's...
This is really in honour of women
everywhere. Everywhere. Amazing.
Thank you both so much.
Thank you very much.
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE
What made our case
so strong was the amazing,
incredible, unbelievably courageous
E. Jean Carroll...
..who had the guts to face him
down twice, the second time
eye to eye, in person,
and tell a story
that no-one thought
anyone would believe
until we got 18 different jurors
who believed it unanimously twice.
# If you feel it
then let's go
# To a place where we belong
# We'll find the
strength to carry on
# Open our hearts
Set our minds at ease
# To have each other
is the hope we need... #
We're serious women.
And a serious woman is
an extremely powerful entity.
The thing is never to despair.
Never despair.
# You're going to rise
# Rise
# Keep on rising
# Rise, rise, rise... #
Adios, my dear fopdoodles.
Make a promise
tonight to take yourself,
for better or worse.
Take pride in your nonconformity.
That's where your power comes.
And remember what
I always say, honey.
Fate loves the fearless.