The House in Between (2020) Movie Script


[man] There's something there
that lets you know it's there.
[man 2] This house,
it's really grabbed me.
It's got its hooks
sinked into me.
There's a lot of thing that happen
in this house that we can't explain.
[man 3] It's wild
just being there.
[man 4] It has this, you know,
this aura about it, a... a... a mystery.
[dramatic music]
[Alice] I wanted a simple house,
I wanted a A-frame house,
and I wanted a... a loft upstairs
with a balcony.
And when we first drove by here,
it was just a beautiful meadow.
It was covered with wildflowers.
And it just took my breath away.
And I said,
you know, "That's it."
[Alice] I had the house
subcontracted, built like I wanted.
When they started building,
we noticed that there were some
strange things happening.
The doors would slam.
I mean nothing else would be blowing
around, but the door would slam.
They put the doorbell in
and it would ring.
And you'd go to the door,
there's nobody there.
I remember deadbolting the door
and going upstairs
and as soon as I get upstairs,
you know, we heard a bang!
I looked out
and the door was open.
But it had the deadbolt
still sticking out.
This house had a lot of activity
that was unusual
and we knew that.
I made peace with that,
I lived with that
until 2011.
[crickets chirping]
[Alice] At 11:30, I was probably
in bed by 12 o' clock.
And it was
pitch-black dark in here.
And a light came on
and I opened my eyes and, uh,
there was this... it was light.
It was a patch of total daylight
from the ceiling to the floor.
And it was daylight
in this tube of light
and it was pitch black
in the rest of the room.
I just stared at it.
After about 10 seconds,
it just went blink, it went out.
I just covered my head
and I pulled back the covers
and I saw there were like,
real bright red buttons of light.
I had a flashlight on the bed
and I shone the flashlight
all around the room
and uh, there was
nothing unusual.
And I really did feel watched.
I felt a presence,
I felt observed.
I didn't know if it was
a religious experience,
I didn't know if it was a UFO
experience, I didn't know what it was.
It scared me to death.
That was a turning point
in my life,
because I decided
that I would not stay here
by myself at night.
I never mentioned it
to hardly anybody in this town
about the paranormal activity
in my house,
because I wasn't sure
how they would take it.
It's a... it's a...
it's in the Bible Belt
and you know... and you know, I just...
I didn't know how they would take it.
[man] Florence
is a suburb of Jackson,
the statistical
metropolitan area.
This is community that's...
that's got good neighbors.
They probably
pretty much keep to themselves
and that may be
what makes them good neighbors.
[woman] I think
the people are real nice.
If somebody dies,
uh, everybody
comes and brings food
and they go to the cemetery
or they go to the funeral halls
or do what they can for you.
We're just country.
Just... just country.
[woman] Florence is a great
town, but it's a southern town.
Some people are open-minded
and some people
are very close-minded.
Florence is very Bible Belt-ish.
Bringing in the paranormal
to them is unbelievable.
Do you believe in ghosts?
Uh, believe in what?
No, I don't.
[man] I am a Christian,
I do believe in the Holy Spirit.
If y'all... y'all go stay out in empty
houses all night, I'll go to bed.
[Alice] I was all embarrassed,
because I thought, you know,
I'm just gonna look like an idiot.
So, I didn't tell anybody
until it became known enough
that I knew there were gonna do
a little news program on it.
[male TV reporter] On the outside,
it looks like your typical home,
but inside
it's anything but normal.
The candle
just got up and landed.
It didn't just tipple over
and it didn't shoot over,
it just kinda
levitated over there.
[Alice] After that news segment,
that just kinda validated to me
that it was okay to express it,
because I just kept it inside,
I didn't tell a lot of people.
But once it was documented,
I felt perfectly
free then to talk about it.
And it was really a big moment.
That kinda made it real for me.
I think that's when it... that's when I
started being really open to really...
I was trying to find
somebody who could...
or maybe come up
with some explanation.
I started talking
to a friend ofmine at work
and she said
she knew a young investigator
named John Bullard
who might be interested.
[John] My name's John Bullard.
I'm a marketing director
for about 40
different restaurants.
What got me
into the paranormal is
ever since I was a little child,
I would see shadow figures,
I would hear voices.
I didn't know
if I was crazy or not
and I wanted
to validate it for myself.
Uh, I didn't want to validate it
for anybody else,
I just wanted to figure out
that I wasn't crazy.
And I started doing research
about the supernatural
and the paranormal.
And I kinda, you know, over time
wanted to test the waters,
so I went to supposedly haunted
places to test the waters,
to see if I could actually
capture something,
if I could feel something
or sense something
that I sensed when I was child.
We accidentally caught
an incredible spirit voice EVP,
electronic voice phenomenon
and that kinda changed me.
[girl] What is that white out
near the woods, you see that?
[girl] It is in the woods,
you see it now?
[girl 2] Oh, no, no, no,
shine closer to it, shine.
[voice] In here.
- [John] What the fuck was that?
- [girl] What was that? What?
Did you say-that place
said "in here?"
[girl] No.
[John] Did y'all not...
you didn't hear that?
[girl] No, I'm sorry.
[voice] In here.
[John] There...
there, did you hear anybody say, "in here?"
[girl] Did someone
just say "in here?"
[John] Did you hear that?
- [man] Uh, I heard something.
- [girl] John.
- I'm not fucking kidding.
- [girl] I'm sorry.
[John] Well, my biggest goal
that I set in my mind was
to document evidence
that was clean, clear,
and easy to view.
[John] Did somebody
just make that noise?
I was referred
to the Mississippi house
by a friend of a friend.
When we pull up to the house,
you would never think there
was anything really going on
inside the house.
So, we were really skeptical,
but we figured
we'd hear her out.
Alice told us about the lights
that she experienced
in the bottom bedroom
and some other sounds
that she'd heard in the house.
And just from the
pre-investigation that we did,
it really started
to intrigue me.
Things moved.
Lights that have turned off.
It's something different
than just
a paranormal investigation.
We have done about nine years,
it's the longest location that
we have ever done consistently.
[John] We have a DVR system
that is filming the house
24 hours a day,
they try to capture
something else.
There's definitely
something else out there,
whether it's a uh,
you know, another world
or something
that we're tapping into.
Uh, it's up...
it's up for debate.
[radio announcer] I have something
very special for you today.
We have Brad Cooney.
Brad is part
of the Mississippi house
and it is very well-documented
as a place that is haunted.
So, tell me a little bit
about the house.
[Brad] Just about everybody
who we bring in there,
it just... it creeps 'em out.
a different energy in there
like you... you mentioned
in your opening.
It's very well-documented,
the evidence captured
is amazing.
[Brad] Will you get
that close cobwebs out?
You see I'm not home so much,
I didn't realize all those
cobwebs are back there.
This is really out of my comfort
zone, this whole thing.
So, I've lived here
uh, 12 years.
12 years now and this is
where I do all my... my podcasts
and throughout
my boxing journalistic career
I've accrued quite a few things
in the boxing world
writing for magazines
and writing for boxing websites.
I've... I've met just about
everybody there is
that's anybody
in the boxing world.
h, Mike Tyson, Oscar De La Hoya,
Floyd Mayweather.
I don't go to the fights anymore though, I
don't cover it, I did it for a lot of years.
It was just time to start
another chapter.
I got into the paranormal
uh, in... in... in...
standing in this very room,
watched TV one day
and a segment
that a local news broadcaster
did on Miss Alice's house
caught my attention.
I stopped what I was doing,
I started watching it
and realized
it was really close,
so I reached out to that homeowner and
her friend that was also on that segment.
'Cause it was
really interesting to me,
especially how close it was.
It was like wow, usually you hear
something's haunted or whatever
or whatever it might be
it's a long drive, but this was
so close to where I live.
So, I would be interested and it
would be really interesting for me
to uh, to see
if they'll have me in there
and take a look around.
So that's all,
that's how I started
getting into the paranormal.
And it just took off from there.
[Brad] I met Alice and when
she told me her story,
I believed her, instantly.
In fact,
the first day I came here,
we had... we had some
activity happen in the house
which really piqued my interest
up at that point.
- [Brad] Actually, they said
- [Alice] You see that?
It was coming towards the stairs
and it went...
- out the door... ooh, ooh, ooh.
- [Alice] Look at that there.
[Brad] The next week
I came back again,
I captured some more evidence
um, that I felt
I couldn't explain.
[Brad] And it... it just
blossomed from there.
We had major equipment failure,
because of spirit activity
all up in this sucker.
But this is a REM pod
that's going nuts.
I learned some of the stuff
through research,
trying things.
Then I got to where
I would buy some equipment.
It's... it's kind of how
I learned how to investigate.
Brad Cooney came along
a few years ago
and really helped out to what we
were doing in the Mississippi house.
[John] It's good to get two
investigators who are separate,
who originally never
knew each other,
who'd come together and are experiencing
the same things in the house.
[Brad] This is my...
I'm beginning my third year
investigating this house.
Once I think I figured
something out,
something else happens.
Some things I've
debunked in... in the home,
but many things I...
I can't debunk
and that in itself is...
is why I keep doing this.
Because there's things that
happen here that I just simply...
I can't figure out
why it's happening.
[Brad] Wait,
that's gotta be somebody.
[knocks on the furniture]
[bumps into the furniture]
[Brad] Ask for somebody that...
ask if anyone's in there?
[Don] Man.
[Brad] That might've been the most
profound noises we've ever heard in here.
[Don] Wow.
[Brad] During
our investigations,
we've heard voices
in this house.
Doors open.
We've seen light shut off.
So, we would start asking,
you shut that light off again?"
And we've actually
gotten direct responses
to where the light
would shut off.
[Brad] Can you make any noise
or do something for us
that will tell us
that we're not alone in here?
[woman] Which one in here?
[Brad] He said the black
[woman] Is this? Oh!
[Brad] Oh my God,
will you look at
[woman] And it's on camera.
[Brad] The chandelier just
shut off by itself.
We believe it's possible that
spirit activity,
spirits that hear us
are communicating with us.
And we try to, get as much as we
can for possibly a breakthrough.
[John] So, I do feel like we are teaching
the spirits to communicate with us.
I feel like we are teaching
the dead
inside the house of Mississippi
how to communicate with us.
[John] Please.
I feel
your static-charged energy,
turn it up for me, please.
There we go.
- [John] There we go!
- [Brad] There we go.
[John] We use a lot of trigger
objects inside the house.
We started putting
a baseball or two baseballs
on the staircase
in the Mississippi house.
And for a while
we set 'em up there
and obviously, we tried to
communicate to the spirits
that we wanted them
to move the baseball,
to roll it down the stairs.
We want nothing more than to hear the baseball
bounce down those stairs and hit the floor.
[Brad] That baseball
sat idle for days.
But then one day
just decided to up and move,
and fall down
the steps by itself.
[dramatic music]
[John] Since then it's happened
several times.
[Brad] What the hell's going
on in this house?
Why do things move that
aren't supposed to move?
Things defy physics.
I want answers.
What happens when we die?
Is there a... does our... do we retain our
consciousness when we cross over and...
and this is what we're hearing
and seeing in... in this house.
The ball moving has intrigued
me the most.
That's something' that I'm
really hungry to find out why.
Why is that ball moving?
Is there something' behind it?
Why? I have no idea why
this is happening.
Let's bring in
somebody who might,
I think that's very,
very important.
Let's see what we got.
What this does,
it holds a level point,
this is what we're gonna
shoot from.
Side to side, it's level.
There might be a little
slope up here, but...
[Alice] Where? Up there, yeah.
[Scott] I couldn't see why
it would roll down there. Okay.
[Alice] I am happy to know
the... the slope,
because we do have
our doors open and close.
And uh, so it's not from, you
know, 'cause somebody might say,
"Oh, it's 'cause your house
is not level." No.
Or if the ball rolls, "Maybe it's
'cause your house is not level." No.
No, but what's crazy is your
house has been level since...
- Since a long time ago.
- '06.
- '06, uh-huh.
- Yeah,
the measurements
are still the same.
[Alice] I hope that
by bringing experts in
that there will be some
discoveries made
that will be
important to us all.
How can objects move that have
no apparent energy source?
There's obviously an answer,
but we don't know it.
There's some sort
of convergence of energy here
that we can't explain.
So, in my opinion all that's
working fine
to the chandelier
and these lights.
And I checked the breaker,
the breaker's shutting it off
and good voltage there.
This dimmer here,
it works fine.
Uh, sometimes
the dimmers would go bad
and make it, you know,
go dimmer.
But that seems to
be working fine.
At this time, I'm not finding
anything wrong with it.
So, I'm not seeing anything
out of the ordinary.
I would... I mean I would've
liked to have seen it
doing what it would,
y'all said it did though.
That would be interesting to me.
I think electricals' fine,
there's nothing wrong with it.
I think you... you're looking
at something else.
[John] So, when you stopped,
after the lights happened,
you decided, "I'm not gonna stay
here anymore."
Did you think about it
when you weren't here?
The first few nights you didn't
stay at the house,
were you kinda wondering
what was going on?
Did you think about coming back
and trying to stay
at the house again?
- Or after you made the decision
- No.
[John] That was it?
No, that was... that
was clear cut.
I'm outta there. Yeah.
Because... because I thought
nobody could help me.
I mean, if you're here
and something',
if there's an intelligence
that's greater than you
and they have these abilities
that are greater than you,
you know you're gone
and nobody...
nobody's gonna be able to help.
No, but I mean you could tell
the... the real fear,
because again you know
It's one of those things you don't talk a lot
about, you know especially in the South.
But when it gets to the point
where you wanna reach out to
which I'm glad you did
Uh, because we uncovered a whole
mountain of stuff, you know.
I think there's times that we
could push ourselves.
But this house sometimes
is so intense
I have to back away.
There's only so much
I can take, you know?
I... I... I have a passion for
this field, documentation, but
this house will push you to uh,
a whole another limit.
Well, you brought up a great
point about...
'cause people have
asked you and me also,
"Why would you be scared if
you've been there so many times?"
It's because we've experienced
what this house can do.
And when you're in this house
by yourself, when it's dark, l
ights are off, door's locked...
- [Brad] Yep.
- It's a different ballgame.
Well, it's interesting that you
know, it took the lights
to be the tipping point
for you to reach out
and actually express it and start
getting people in here to help you.
I mean, maybe somebody else
has experienced that,
maybe somebody else
understands what it might be.
[phone ringing]
[Alice's voice over the phone]
So, I was invited by Alice
to come
and investigate her house.
At first,
I was a little hesitant,
but I talked to her
on the phone
and something really
is troubling her.
You know, I could just tell
how sincere she was
and how much
this house scared her.
I mean, the fact that it's been
10 years
and she hasn't slept
in the house.
And the fact that she's opened
it up to other people
trying to figure out
what is happening here.
And they showed me a lot of
things that I couldn't explain.
There may be something
paranormal happening,
but it
could be anything, you know?
But I wanna start checking
things off.
"Okay, no, it's not this."
And I wanna help them get
to the bottom of it.
- [Steve] Hi, Alice.
- How are you doing?
- [Steve] How are you?
- Good.
- [Steve] It's nice to see you.
- Aww, it's good to see you.
- [Steve] Thank you.
- [Alice] It really is.
Uh, I have some uh,
people here and
- Hey, y'all.
- ...we're ready to do this.
[Steve] John and Brad realized
that they've sort of done
about all that they can.
Now it's time to step in and
bring it to the next level.
It's time to bring in some...
some other people.
I got
all of these different experts
to come together
and get answers.
[Morgan] Millions of years ago,
when the dinosaurs
walked the Earth,
this area was actually
the bottom of the shallow sea.
If you find
a dinosaur bone in Mississippi,
it's not gonna be
a land-based dinosaur.
In fact,
it's a huge prehistoric whale
in the Mississippi
science museum.
All this life settles to the
and over the eons
becomes limestone.
Florence was an early area
of mining for this limestone.
[John] The house is not
an 1800s house,
the house was built in the '90s.
And even at the construction
of the house,
she already had
experiences going on.
To me, I would assume that
something' associated with the land
and not necessarily the house.
I'm Qilin Dai from Jackson
State University,
professor of physics.
There is a theory out
there that limestone
...can perhaps
retain energy and release it.
Uh, would that be something
that's possible in your opinion?
[Qilin] I think
it's very possible.
Limestone and mineral... other
they can absorb energy.
The simplest way
for a lime or rock
to absorb energy
is the heat,
so they can be heated,
so then they have
this energy, thermo energy.
And then they can deliver this
so energy can be
transported through them.
[Steve] Do you think that...
like underground water
or moving water
could create a static charge?
Is that even a possibility?
[Qilin] With water
underground the earth
cannot create any charges.
Maybe because of lighting
something from nature,
it can be charged,
but they cannot create
new charges.
So, this is law.
Okay. As you can see here,
and this is a...
a ball here and um
- and...
- Where is the ball?
See that little circle
right there?
- Oh, I see it, I see it.
- Yeah.
And what happens a lot of the
is it will propel forward
and just start to fall
down the stairs.
And, in your opinion,
would it be possible
that energy could do that?
It's not earthquake?
That was my first
thought. It was
Yeah, it's a
[Michael] Michael Dennin,
I am the Vice Provost for teaching
and learning here at UC Irvine.
So, it's really interesting
footage like this
where you have like a ball.
In this case, there's a ball in
the stairs
and then it suddenly
moves and rolls down the stairs.
First of all, it's a ball,
so that's kind of makes it
a little easier,
'cause those do roll.
Um, the challenge is figuring
what would've kicked or got
the ball rolling.
The dramatic part is simply
that the ball starts it all.
Being on stairs, once it gets
it's gonna fall down the
and that part is pretty
This is a bit of a challenge.
You can't deny that
the ball moved.
I can speculate,
I can say things like,
"There's a little bit
of shaking in the house."
Some wind you didn't notice.
Which is harder to believe,
'cause winds hardly move a ball.
There's a lot of ways I can
imagine if I wanted to fool you,
I could certainly set up ways
that a ball would move with
nobody home.
If the ball is made of iron and
then they have the uh...
- [Steve] Magnet.
- Magnet.
To attract or you know,
repel that...
- that is come different story for this.
- I see.
[Steve] So, you think if the...
it's more trickery than
[Qilin] Yeah.
[Steve] I bet
air will do a little bit.
[Brad] There's no breeze
coming through
this house that's this powerful?
[Alice] No.
[Qilin] A ball
can move by itself
maybe we could not see
the uh, force,
for example like air.
We cannot see the air, but we
can prove there are air there.
[Qilin] We could not
see the motion,
but we can see the results,
we can see it's moving.
As a scientist, I don't
believe ghosts at all.
I believe science.
[Michael] Without it being
a complete hoax,
how would you explain
something like this?
I know ultimately the end result
is a physics action,
like the ball starts moving,
so the immediate cause of that
also has to be a physics action.
I... I do think it...
it's not air, it's not wind, uh,
it's certainly not magnet.
[Brad] I... I think we could
check under the stairs maybe.
[Steve] There's no holes here.
Do you wanna see what happens
if I give it
a bit of punch up here?
- [man] Yeah.
- See if the ball moves maybe.
[man] Go ahead.
[Steve] Anything?
[man] Nothing,
it's not even moving.
[Michael] If you
really were there,
I guess rule out what I would
call, "the trivial physical cases",
and rule out the... the
cases of hoaxes,
then you're
into this interesting realm of,
"Okay, something physical
caused it,
but what caused that physical?"
Most ideas of a ghost
involve the ghost
being non-physical
in some fundamental way.
Any paranormal explanation
is still going to involve
something applying a force to
the ball.
And so therefore,
the thing applying
the force by definition,
we've just made it
So, it's just an interesting
that, to me, moves it
from science to detective story.
[Brad] In the years
that I've been here,
I want to experience
some lights.
I've seen
so many things in this house
and with my own eyes,
but that's what I wanna...
that's what I wanna see.
Those lights that you saw.
We got all kinds
of just great stuff
and just stuff that's just direct responses
and it's... it's fully intelligent.
You know, it's not residual,
it's intelligent stuff happening
in the house,
but there's that
carrot that's dangling
- [Brad] Like the Holy Grail
- [John] Those lights
The Holy Grail of what we're
trying to capture here
is those... those...
the lights that Alice saw.
[John] Yeah.
[John] Over the years,
I've experienced
one thing with lights.
[John] So, I was upstairs in the
bedroom at the Mississippi house
with the door closed, we were
doing an EVP session.
It was me and one fellow
[John] And the bottom frame
of the door
turned bright white
and it was
almost like a camera shutter,
two to three flashes of light.
I sat there, kind of, in
awe for a few minutes.
It was not raining, there was
no thunder, the night was clear.
I opened the door and it
never happened again.
We luckily did capture
that on film.
[Brad] Miss Alice has had
experiences with the lights,
the... these are the... the lights
that have scared her
to where she doesn't want to...
to live in this house anymore.
I personally don't feel that's
a spirit activity or a ghost,
I think
that's something different.
Perhaps, extra-terrestrial.
It's something different going
on with those lights.
There is a woman who lives
7 miles from me,
she's an elderly lady
and so this happened
when she was a child,
but she said that
her house lit up in a globe.
And she said it was brighter
than the sun,
I remember that...
that expression.
Many years ago,
when I lived... when I worked in
Alice was in and out of the
library where I worked a lot,
'cause she lived close by.
And I was telling her about this
light that I saw
when I was
growing up
right down in this
And I was asleep at night
and I was awake, just fla...
you know, flash and my...
my light in my bedroom
was lighter than...
well, it was just a white light.
A clear white brilliant light.
[Jerry] Flash bulb bright.
- Yeah, something like that.
- It's just super, super bright.
The trees and the house
on the hill and everything
[Jerry] Brilliant, brilliant
Was just brilliant,
brilliant light.
It just faded away.
And I just went back to bed
and went back to sleep.
You know, it's just... there's
too much space
to be the only
ones here.
[Jeanette] She didn't know
what that is in her house
and I don't know what
that was at my house.
It's strange, I... you know,
it... it's really strange.
[Steve] The woman that I spoke
to you about Alice Jackson.
Uh-huh, yes, yeah.
[Steve] Uh, she'd said that
in her bedroom...
there was a glowing light
and then disappeared.
In... in your opinion,
is there anything
in terms of energy, science,
things that are happening that could
create an illuminated ball of light.
A light cannot happen
it has to have
origin to have this light.
If we have like other light,
maybe reflection
from window or from other place,
it's possible
to have that.
Or they have other energy
transfer to become light.
Like uh, thermal energy,
electric energy,
so it's kind of
a complicated question
to... to
be answered simply.
[Walt] There's a phenomenon in
nature called "St. Elmo's fire",
which is a static electricity
If you have a build-up of static
electricity for some reason,
yeah, it can cause a glow.
Uh, especially if it has some
kind of medium to act on it.
Sometimes, all it takes
is just dust in the air.
If it were a ball of lightning
she was seeing in her house,
she wouldn't have to ask,
because it would tear
something up,
because this is a lot of
energy, that's very destructive.
[Michael] Strange lights are
often the easiest
to offer different
explanations to
of all physics
Light is the most flexible
in a weird way.
The challenge is often
recreating them
or figuring out
exactly what did it, um,
at a level that would make
someone confident
that it really was
just a physics effect.
If I knew that it was... had a
natural explanation,
you know like, you know,
I've heard now various theories
about what
could cause lights
and if somebody definitively
"Oh, it's the minerals
and salt, something, you know,
the natural
that's causing the lights."
Then I would
immediately not be afraid.
But uh, since that hasn't
it might be UFO stuff,
it might be you know, some sort
of inter-dimensional stuff
that was from some civilization
that was more advanced than we are.
And so, in the beginning,
you thought they were
extra-terrestrial, UFOs?
It... it crossed my mind.
It really did cross my mind,
that was
the very first thing I thought.
I have never seen anything that I can
reconcile this with in my history, you know,
reading or anything
except maybe all the stuff that
I had heard about UFO stuff.
You know, beams of light
and people disappearing.
[Calvin] My name's Calvin Parker
and I was abducted in 1973.
October, 1973.
It was just over here, uh,
length of a football field and
back that way.
And that's where it sat down
and when it originally sat down
on a space in the river.
And I could see the blue lights
coming over my shoulder.
When they stopped
and it opened up
and then
a real bright light come out.
Three robot-looking
creatures came out.
Two of 'em got hold of my sail.
Took us aboard,
gave us an examination.
I didn't know what a UFO was or
an alien was till this happened.
And I still don't know
that it was aliens.
It could've been something from
an inter-dimension you know,
travelled through.
I hadn't ruled that out.
All I know is something
Certainly, for modern physics,
we do believe that the world is
More than just the three
dimensions of space we move through
and the one dimension of time.
Most of what
we understand about physics
is probably best-explained
with extra dimensions.
It becomes interesting to try
and figure out and understand
what that means for things like
multi-dimensional beings
and how different thing
interact with our reality.
And we're not even at the beginning
from a physics point of view
to make statements or
understand about that.
I think that's an area of
that we're gonna find
fascinating in the future.
I do think that the potential
of extraterrestrial life
is there.
Do I think it's in
Alice's bedroom?
No, I definitely
don't think she is,
you know, waiting for the
next alien visit.
But something scared her
and that's what
we're trying to figure out.
What is it?
I think it's something
This is something ghostly, this
is something of our world.
I don't think it's anything that
has to do with outer space,
UFOs or extraterrestrials.
[Brad] We are recording.
You ready?
- [Alice] You have everything?
- [John] I was born ready.
[Brad] Let me just make sure
this bad boy is still...
[John] We're here tonight
to communicate
with any spirit
that's in this house.
We've been here
for a long time.
We've logged a lot of
hours in this house.
Any intelligent spirit
that's in this house tonight,
we want you to come down here
and communicate with us.
And make yourself known.
There's devices to alarm to let
us know that you're near us.
We want you to come down here
and just like you have
many times before
let us know that you're here,
let us feel your energy.
[Brad] I might've
just saw a light dim.
[Sabrina] It's the REM pod.
REM pod's going off.
[Brad] Chandelier light dim
right before that.
Just by a few seconds.
[John] Don't worry about the MV.
- [Sabrina] Oh, we got a REM pod going here.
- [Brad] The REM pod over here?
[Ilene] All right, y'all go ahead,
I'll stay in here and watch this one.
[John] Steady.
[long bip]
[Sabrina] This one is off.
It was steady.
See, I have to see patterns.
If all three REM pods goes off,
I'm a little more interested in
this one where REM pod goin' off.
[Brad] I'd like to see
like the light go off
and the REM pod to go
off at the same time.
That'd be much more
convincing for me.
[Sabrina] Yeah.
That'd be pretty awesome.
[John] We're trying to understand
and help you communicate
the years we've been here.
[strong bips]
[Ilene] Oh, we've got REM
pods everywhere.
[Sabrina] Oh!
Oh, all of 'em are going off.
- We got one at the mantel.
- [Sabrina] We got a big one here.
One on the stairs,
um, I don't know.
Brad, anything back
here going on?
[Brad] Just the REM pod.
- You have the REM pod too?
- [Sabrina] Another REM pod.
[Ilene] All three of 'em
were going off.
[Brad] So, all three just went
off at the same time?
- [Sabrina] There it goes again.
- [Brad] Which is pretty cool,
because I'd...
I'd mentioned before
about wanting to see
all three of 'em go off.
[Ilene] And yellow and green.
[John] I can't get a center sell
without it going off, huh?
[Alice] Yeah.
- [Brad] Is that all?
- [Alice] Yeah, that's where
[Brad] Yeah,
I'll just shut my mouth.
It's a little more interesting to me
for sure when all these devices go off.
However, I'm still
not 100% sold.
[John] We use
some uh, devices and
uh, they measure energy.
And uh, we had one set up
in the living room,
one in the back bedroom,
one in the stairs.
We wanted to separate 'em
as much as possible.
Uh, and we do that so
there's consistency.
If one can go off, we can
manipulate another one.
Uh, if they all go off at the
same time,
that's... that's
pretty impressive,
which is indicative
of some kind of energy,
something... uh,
something going on.
Something not normal.
It's something, over the years,
I've just never had happen.
The light of God surrounds us,
the love of God enfolds us,
the power of God protects us,
the presence of God
watches over us.
Wherever we are, God
is and all is well.
[strong bip]
[Brad] There's a REM pod going.
[Sabrina] Oh,
where's that REM pod?
- [Ilene] Is that REM pod up there?
- [Brad] Back bedroom.
[Ilene] Back in that... you
or is it going off?
[John] Back room! Here.
[Brad] Okay, great.
[strong bip]
[John] This room is heavy, man.
And as soon as I came in
the room, I felt uneasy.
[Alice] We've actually had
two mediums
who didn't know each other
and hadn't been here before
and both of 'em said
that there was a figure
that they felt a presence
of it near that chair.
And that he really was stern
and... and guarded.
He was like a guard for the,
you know the room,
the place that
he felt like, it was his place.
- [Brad] Interesting.
- [John] Just like that.
[Brad] I can't explain that...
that much consistency.
That was wild.
[Steve] Alice has had psychics
investigate the house before
and she wanted to have
another one take a look around.
And I don't use psychics
on... on many investigations
just because it's very hard
to quantify what they're saying,
but this was
important to Alice.
So, we got somebody
from out of state,
they came from California.
One thing I did think it was
important is
using a psychic or
a medium
who has never been to
the house before
and even furthermore,
making sure they didn't have
any idea where they were going.
She didn't know anything,
only because that would lend more
credibility to what they were saying.
[woman] Very interesting.
Oh, okay.
Now am I...
- do you just want me to go on in.
- [Steve] Yeah, that's right.
- [Steve] Ring the bell.
- [Jill] Yeah.
- Hi!
- [Jill] Hi.
- [Jill] I'm Jill.
- I'm Alice. Come in.
- Nice to meet you, Alice.
- Nice to meet you, too.
Thank you for having me here.
Absolutely, we're delighted.
- Where would you like me to go?
- The house is yours.
- Okay.
- [Alice] This is yours.
[Jill] Very good.
So uh, what I'll do is I'm
just gonna start down here.
I am not gonna say
too much at first,
if you have any questions
though for me, feel free to ask.
[Alice] And I'm just gonna
sit over here.
[Jill] Hmm. Is this a door
to go outside?
[Alice] It is, you can open
it if you'd like.
- [Jill] Do you mind?
- [Alice] No, not at all.
- [Jill] Okay, I have to do this.
- [Alice] Not at all.
[Jill] I have to get out here
and look at this.
It's very interesting.
[Jill] Can I ask you a question?
Was there a house
that was right over here
- that's no longer there?
- Behind Yes.
That's what I thought, okay.
That's important to me.
What I like to do is I just like
to go through
and pick some
really strong focal points
and then I'm gonna
address them
like I did with that other door.
I'm just checking
everything out.
This one now.
[Jill] Wow.
There's a lot of different
dimensions going on,
there's a lot of shifting
going on in this house.
I'm gonna ask you a
couple of questions.
About a week ago, I started
having some very unusual dreams
that turned
into what I call a "series."
I document them, I
have a dream diary.
I also sometimes sketch.
What is so unusual
is as soon as I saw that door,
went outside,
I knew this was the door.
This is the sketch that I did,
the walking stick leaning up
against the door.
- Do you have a walking stick?
- Uh, uh, hundreds.
[Jill] That's... that's insane.
[Alice] With faces,
I collect 'em.
[Jill] I don't even know if
I should say this.
- I don't know if this
- I'm a psychiatric nurse,
I've heard of murder stories,
I've heard of abuse, everything
I don't want you to panic, it's
nothing to panic about
but it is to me,
it's a very sad imprint.
There was somebody killed
in your backyard.
I do think there were landowners
that lived here initially
that did not treat
people so well.
The male, I feel him here.
I don't use this phrase
very often,
but he was an evil person.
And I do think he had
something to do
with the man that was
killed in the back.
He's going to do whatever he can
to try to get you to give up.
If he could burn this
house down, he would.
Like I keep seeing
things on fire,
it's constantly setting
fire, constantly setting fire.
We had a number of people
who heard that.
[loud bip]
[Steve] Then that's weird.
[Jill] You struck a thought.
I've heard of history
of fires in this town.
[Mary Alice]
Florence burned several times.
First time it was uh,
facing west
and when they rebuilt,
they built it north,
so that's the reason it's built
with facing north now.
[Jill] Do we know
what caused the fire?
And from what I know, they...
they don't know.
I mean, you know?
- But the fire created
- But there
Wherever the fire was created,
the... the uh, geographical
- [fire detector bips]
- [Alice] Uh-huh.
That's what... that's what he was
saying that ...that... that... that
[Jill] It's a fire detector.
[Brad] All right, right there
in the hallway.
[Jill] Smoke detector.
We're talking about fire
and the smoke detector
battery beeps.
[Alice] My neighbor
Erin next door,
moved there when she was 5
years old.
And uh, she's had a very
significant part in this house,
but the main thing is that when
she was 5 years old,
she would tell me that there was
something buried in the backyard.
And I would say, "What?"
And she would say, "It
might be a body."
I've lived
in this house next door
since I was about 5
years old.
And ever since I've lived here,
I've always thought there was
something different
about next-door
even as a child.
Uh, I would walk
over there sometimes
and one day I was over there
and I just had
a strong feeling of,
"Oh, there's
something, something different."
And uh, I was probably
6 or 7 years old.
And I was just convinced
that there was somebody
buried in the backyard.
And um, I... I told my parents
for years
that there is somebody
buried in that backyard.
And uh, you couldn't convince
me otherwise.
And I... I still think that now.
I was very adamant about
it as a child.
And I still get that feeling
over there and when I'm in that
spot, I'm just driven to that...
that particular area and I
always have been.
One time I... I said I was gonna
go dig it up
and prove that
there was something there.
If you walk
between our house and Alice's,
you'll see the property line.
These big oak trees that
make a straight line.
That's the property line.
Seems like once you cross that
property line, you're...
- In a different dimension.
- You're protected, yeah.
- Yeah.
- It won't let us...
My parents sadly have never had
anything happen um,
we never uh noticed anything,
heard anything,
but the minute you cross back
over this tree line into her yard,
it um... you can
just feel it that it's here.
I was visiting
with Miss Alice once
and we were sitting in the dining room
up... under the-the chandelier light.
And she goes, "Look, look up."
And I looked up and the... the
chandelier um,
it had rotated itself
like with the chain,
there was no tension in it.
It was... it was tilted
on its side.
And I screamed, I mean,
real loud scream
and she screamed
and both of us jumped up and
ran over to the front door.
And the chandelier let go
and it was swinging
so hard and far,
like this, just going
Like a pendulum.
Yeah, it was scary.
I've been scared over there
and just scared
to go over there many times.
[John] Flashlight?
Here, give you a light.
Thank you.
- [Brad] Hey, Erin.
- [Erin] Hey.
[Jill] So
I'm doing well, how
are you doing?
- [Brad] Good, good to see you.
- [Erin] You too.
How are you?
- [Erin] I'm good.
- [John] Long time no see.
You doing all right?
- Yeah, I'm hanging in there.
- [John] Good, good.
[Alice] So, we're going to go
to where you think
there might be
something in the backyard.
- Yes.
- Okay.
- There are a couple of spots.
- So, we're gonna follow you.
[Alice] Watch your steps.
[Brad] So, you felt like drawn
to this spot, Erin?
Yeah, since I was uh, probably
about 6 years old,
I've always felt
that there was...
something over on this land.
That every time I was in one
of... in this spot,
one of the stronger ones,
I just always
thought it was a body here.
Or something significant
happened to the body here.
But this is one of
the main ones.
This was the one that I... I
came to when I was real little.
We would come over here and
play like little tea parties
And stuff at her backyard.
She'd let us in.
And I just didn't want to
come play in this spot.
Erin actually did find four
bodies near the Pearl River.
People knew they were
there from the Civil War
and uh, and adults were trying to
find those bodies and they couldn't.
That other guy told me that
when he took me
along that sometimes children
are more open to... to
that adults want to be
close-minded to.
And so, he wanted me to try it.
And um,
everywhere that I walked
over and they crossed,
they put a flag
and then later that day,
went and did whatever they do.
And where I had marked, they
found all four bodies.
[Brad] That validates
this one here.
- Validates, yeah.
- Right.
[Brad] And what else.
How could you have more
validation than that,
that's impressive.
Well, you wanna try to do
a EVP session right here?
- [Brad] Sure.
- Are you okay with that?
Oh yeah, take it around?
But... but you know, you
can grab onto me.
- Okay.
- You trust me after a few years, don't you?
Yeah, I'll do it, I'll
hang out... okay.
All right, you ready?
- [Brad] Yeah.
- Okay.
Is there somebody out
here in the yard?
Or the land?
Can you give us
some kind of sign
that you're aware that
Erin is standing right here?
Do you know Erin?
[Brad] Hear that?
- [John] It's like rustling in the bushes.
- [Brad] Yeah, yeah.
Is there something
buried in the yard?
[loud thump]
I'm not gonna lie,
I jumped a little.
[Brad] That was a little...
it was kinda loud.
It was kinda loud
whatever that was.
- [John] Can you tell us what
- [Erin] I feel like I'm gonna throw up.
- [Brad] Really?
- Real sick.
Just give me a... I just
need to breathe.
- [John] Okay.
- Let me breath for a moment.
- [John] Wanna walk out this way?
- [Erin] Mm-hmm.
- [Brad] Which way?
- [Erin] Just over here to the bushes.
[John] Oh my God.
- [Brad] You okay?
- [Erin] Mm-hmm.
[Erin gagging]
[John] You okay?
[Erin] My stomach just got
tied up in knots.
[John] It's okay.
[Erin] I don't think
I've ever spent
longer than four seconds
standing in that spot.
[Steve] Right now, we have
a dog roaming the property
and trying to see
if he can get hits
and see if he can pick up
on the scent of the bacteria
that feeds on human remains.
Probing the aerated soil,
so that if there is any cadaver
source here
it will allow the odor
to come up easier
and make it a little stronger
for the dog to be able to work.
[Paulette] Slight interest
and you can see
where he kept going back
to that one area.
So, I'm going to run him
through that area.
If it's someone buried,
the dog's gonna show
a lot of interest to the trees.
And if a body is buried
and the trees grow up,
well they use the body as
And so, the tree takes on that
and it's in their leaves
and things like that.
[Paulette] He's going around
these clumps of trees.
These are the only trees that
he's looking up into, you know,
cause there are a lot of trees
on this property,
but this section was
what he's showing interest in
and looking up into
the trees.
It's kinda like when we did a
case in another state,
the body was buried
uh, and then they went back
and dug it up
and moved it
to another location.
The odor and the decomp was
still in the ground.
So, it's that type of thing.
So, yeah it could be way old.
[Paulette] He's not given us
a definite location.
He's just giving us where he is
picking up odor
and it's coming
through the trees.
It's the odor that he has been
trained for,
I would investigate and see
whether or not there
was a cemetery here.
And if they moved any bodies
and that may give you an
answer to why the odor is here.
We brought some cadaver
dogs over there, right?
[Jeanette] Uh-huh.
Um, which they smell
decomposition and bacteria
that feeds on human bodies...
that sort of thing.
And those dogs were picking up
that odor in and around her yard
and so, we wanted to do a little
research and see if perhaps
there's ever been
any sort of evidence
of a burial there or a
graveyard at any point in time?
This is a picture of the
Florence Cemetery.
[Steve] Right, yep.
This part that's clear
that is the original part
of the cemetery.
[Steve] All this here?
- All of this.
- [Steve] Okay, okay.
When the town burned, all of
the records were burned.
And there is not any records
anywhere on that part of it.
[Steve] I see.
Do you think where Miss Alice's
house is that perhaps
there could have been
something like that
before record keeping,
like before it all burnt?
It could be, but if it is,
I don't think there is
any record of that.
So, if there was a grave of some
sort or a burial
where Miss Alice lives now,
it would've had
to have been before the fire.
[Jeanette] Right.
In regards to this, where
is Alice's house?
Is it say, north?
- [Jeanette] Okay. Right.
- Is it east or west?
[Jeanette] All right, she's
on this Clear Branch road.
[Steve] Okay.
So, it will be up here.
Okay, so her house
is somewhere...
Her house would be around here.
So, her house is around here
where the unmarked section is.
Right, it would be
on about there.
[Steve] So, there are plenty
of unmarked burials in Florence,
but no real evidence
to show
that it's right there
on Alice's property.
But nobody knows where those
burials were prior to the fire.
After the fire, everything
was destroyed.
All the records for the town,
so, there could have been
something prior.
We can't jump to any conclusions,
but we can speculate.
[Steve] Would you ever consider moving
back into the house and living here?
What would it take?
I uh...
if I didn't live here alone,
you know,
if somebody else lived with me,
I'd probably, you know,
I could do it, I could do it.
But... but alone here, uh, I
haven't come to that point.
I mean, I haven't been
to that place yet.
I really haven't.
I'm not saying I couldn't,
but I haven't.
I'm not ready yet.
Because I still, I still don't
know where I might end up.
[Steve] I hope
this process helps her,
I really do, that's the goal,
that's what we're trying to...
I think we're 80% there,
to be honest with you.
I think we're about 80% there.
Are we ever gonna get her back
in the house sleeping at night?
I don't know.
I hope through this
process, it uh...
There's no crying in
ghost hunting, so...
I want to get to the point
where we can get her
at peace with all of this.
She wants to get back here,
she wants to live here,
she wants to be in here.
She wants to do everything.
She knew it was the place
to raise a family,
her daughter, her everything.
And uh, it was taken
away from her and uh,
we need to get that
[Alice] The reason I still have
my house and I haven't sold it
is because I really believe
it has a purpose.
I think, you know,
opening it up to people
is the way that
something will be found.
If I sold it, somebody else
might not be open to that.
But I think there's more to it.
I think everybody involved in
this house
has a real closeness,
a genuine concern
about each other.
I really have enjoyed the
people that I've met.
Uh, I have a lot of special
affection for John and Brad.
I mean, I really do, I feel
like they're family.
And even though we have
our lives separate, from here
we... we are
definitely connected here.
[Brad] It's been quite a ride
from the first day I was here
to my current uh, relationship
and friendship
with Miss Alice.
Alice will be in my life forever
even... uh, maybe when I pass
away, when I cross over,
if she crosses over
before me, we will hang out.
If uh... if I cross over,
well maybe I'll kick
the ball down the steps on her.
Being involved in investigating
paranormal activity
has become
a mid-life second wind for me.
It's something that I've found
that I really enjoy doing.
And couple that
with helping a friend,
Miss Alice, really has
been beneficial for my life.
It's just... it's added a...
a fresh chapter
in my mid-life years.
It's made me wanna get up
and hit... hit the ground
running more in my life.
So, it's a very, very important
part of my life now.
[John] We're a great team.
We make time for each other
and I think that
we are locked in to figuring out
what's going on in the house.
I would like to see Alice in a
happy place
where she's satisfied
with the work that we've done.
And I think she's gotten
some answers.
I think there's key answers
that she still has not had.
And end game for the
Mississippi house.
In my opinion, I don't know if
there is one,
and I think that this is a house
where we're learning,
we're teaching.
And I think it's something that
we can continue to do
for years to come.
[dramatic music]
- [Brad] I put it on there this morning.
- [John] Yeah.
[John] What do you mean
you put it on this morning?
- [Brad] I aimed my camera.
- [Steve] You did?
- [John] Hey! Check this!
- [Brad] No, I aimed the camera
Check it, how do you check it?
- [Steve] I don't know.
- [John] I got chills right now.
Dude, that just did that.
I don't... wasn't near
it, nobody was there.
I saw that.
- [Steve] So, if we got that...
- [John] Dude, here.
- [Brad] We got that.
- [John] Holy!
[Steve] Do you know
how to check it on there?
How to bring it up on there?
[Brad] Yeah, it's gonna be
quick right here.
[Steve] That's okay.
It... it'll be...
[John] Dude, come on, you gotta
be kidding me right now.
[Brad] Don't believe it.
Yeah, here we go, here's
my last shot.
It was rolling.
- [John] Yeah, we got it?
- [Brad] Yeah, it's not there anymore.
All right, so I was inside
and I was running around,
I'm trying to get this gear sent out,
because we have
gear shipping out today.
Got the camera,
I'm messing with that
and I'm just going inside
of the house.
And nobody
was right here at all,
nobody was in the house,
it was just me.
Uh, and I'm walking by and all
of a sudden, I hear this ball
falling, falling down the
stairs and there it is.
We're checking if we have
it on camera right now.
There's the ball and it
came from up there.
I like it,
but the fact that there's
people in the house
moving around, all that stuff.
- [John] Okay, yeah.
- Just kinda makes me like...
[Kendall] I w... I was the only
one in the house.
- [Steve] Yeah, it's true.
- [Kendall] You know what I mean?
- [Kendall] And I
- [Brad] Yeah, you were outside.
[Kendall] I... I promise, dude.
Like I... this whole thing's
about honesty,
like I'm honest
with you guys.
I was walking with
the ball as it was
- [Brad] We just saw.
- [Kendall] I heard a noise
and I looked over
and it was like
dunk, dunk, dunk,
dunk, dunk.
[John] I mean we have like
I mean this is the clip, this is
the footage we've been waiting,
like this is evidence that
we've been waiting to get.
- [Steve] Who's that?
- [Brad] Oh, that must be Alice.
[Kendall] Uh-oh. Oh, dude!
- [Steve] Can you pull it back?
- [Brad] Oh yeah.
[Steve] What are... like what
are your thoughts?
I'm really curious,
what do you think?
Well... I mean, you guys see this all...
look see that
[Brad] Okay, I'm gonna pause it,
I'm gonna frame this.
- [Brad] Hey guys!
- [John] Yeah?
- [Brad] There's nobody in here.
- [John] What?
- Get outta here!
- [Steve] So, we had a door move?
I don't know.
But it... it sounded like the
front door opened or closed.
- But...
- [John] No, I definitely heard that.
I... you thought it was Alice.
[Kendall] Dude, I got freaking
chills on my hand right now.
- [Steve] Wait a second, look, no
- [Kendall] Get outta here.
- [John] No, wait, wait, wait.
- [Kendall] What?
[John] Let's hear that.
I think the wind probably
blew it open.
[Kendall] Alright.
I mean that would
be my assessment.
- I think that's what it was.
- [Kendall] Okay.
- Honestly, I think
- [Kendall] Yep.
Everybody just for whatever
reason leaves this door like
this, it's never really
You know?
But that doesn't
explain the ball.
[Kendall] What do you think?
I mean it's happened in
this house many times.
Like eight or nine times.
So, I mean it's always exciting
when it happens.
It's always exciting
when it happens.
I mean that door sound
is interesting.
And you know the thing is, I
mean it could be wind, right?
[Steve] We... well, yeah.
The doors open?
[Brad] So, it closes by itself.
- [Kendall] Wait a minute.
- Well, assuming it's that door.
Because I thought it was that
front door
swinging open and
hitting the closet door.
But the door's open right now.
So, it either wasn't that door,
it was a different door.
[Brad] Definitely sounded
like a door closing.
[Brad] A few days went by and I
was wondering what that noise was.
Something that I wanted
to figure out.
And it was just bothering me,
it was frustrating me for real.
It was a frustrating four
or five days, I think.
I was trying to figure
out what it was.
The camera back there, it was
aiming that way behind me.
And I noticed some movement
in the reflection of the
It has a brass ball like un...
un... un... beneath it.
So, I started
looking closer at that
and I zoomed in and then bam!
My heart started racing.
What I saw you know,
were two...
two different doors um, opening.
And then one of 'em
open and closed.
It was like something...
it was like something just came through.
It's one thing to capture
a door opening,
but it's really
a different level
when you see a door open
and then close itself.
Like that I mean I haven't
seen that before.
Now I can't tell you what...
what the heck did that.
But something moved
not only the chandelier
but opened and
closed doors.
[Jill] It's very interesting.
That's important to me.
[Brad] Theoretically,
a gust of wind
could open it maybe,
but open
and close it, two of 'em?
In theory, I guess
it's possible.
Don't forget you know, minutes,
minutes before that
a baseball
was flipped down the steps.
And the doors were closed.
Not to mention there was
hardly any breeze at all.
This is a Mississippi
hot summer day.
So... so when you
bundle all that up
and you look at that,
that is some dramatic activity
all within minutes.
You see now we got lights like
yeah, those lights are
freaking out.
I don't have all the answers, I
just don't think it was normal.
You know, was it a ghost?
Yeah, it could be.
It wasn't a human
in physical form.
This is... and this is
gonna continue on.
It's... it's not to the point
where she'll just be,
it's over with."
Until we can figure out what's
going on,
Miss Alice is going to
pursue and keep trying to
find the answers.
What created those lights?
And I'll be right by her side.
We're... we're gonna do this
together and figure this out.
Bless Alice, Lord.
And be with her always.
[Walt] I think the attraction
to all of it is,
there's always been the
question, what's after death?
And anybody who hasn't thought
about, that is a liar.
I think if you find proof of
then you found your
proof of life after death.
And you don't have to
just take it on faith.
And we being human beings,
we'd like to have proof of it.
Uh, I really think that's
the attraction of it.
I... I think that that will always
be the attraction of ghost stories.
I think this is one of those
mysterious areas of life
that this is gonna have to be
something that people deal with
in their own hearts, their
own minds.
And come to their
own conclusions.
And just be true to themselves.
When I was growing up,
my grandmother
told us one time that uh,
they had a ghost in their house.
Every night that ghost would
come there and go up the steps.
So finally, they decided they
would go
and they would find
out what the ghost was.
So, they went out that night
and about
the middle of the night,
here come several goats
going up and down the steps,
up and down the steps.
So, their ghost was
a goat ghost. Debunk.