Kara Swisher Wants to Live Forever (2026) s01e02 Episode Script
Science or Snake Oil?
1
- Oh, my.
Both: Wow.
[quirky music]
- Doesn't this land
in the backyard
of a Colorado household
owned by a woman named Mindy?
[laughter]
- Mork and Mindy.
- It's a state-of-the-art
sound-therapy pod
that is using sound
playing in your body.
So there's a lot
of science-based frequencies
designed to calm your nervous
system at a cellular level.
We typically call it an inner-
and out-of-body experience.
- You know those moments
where you suddenly have
to ask yourself,
how did I end up here?
- This feels like
the lamest crypt in the world,
and I'm stuck with Kara.
- [laughs] Well,
Emily Ratajkowski was busy.
This was one of those.
I was deep inside
a concrete basement
in New York City
about to embark
on an auditory journey
that is designed to help
my body repair,
restore, and transform itself.
- We're going to take you
on a beautiful sound journey.
- Sound journey, Scott.
- All right.
- My traveling companion
was my good friend
and podcast partner,
Scott Galloway.
- I just had
a deep insight, Kara.
This longevity trend hasn't
the Earth suffered enough?
Shouldn't we just die?
- [laughs]
Oh.
[jazzy music]
One of the things
that's really disturbing,
as usual,
with the use of social media,
with all this knowledge
everywhere, Dr. Google,
everyone thinks they're
an expert, and they are not.
- When I wake up,
the first thing I do
is drink Longevity Mix.
- It's packed with CoQ10.
- I'm gonna NAD
for the rest of my life,
and I'm never gonna age.
- Social media is flooded with
celebrity wellness influencers
hawking breakthrough therapies,
claiming they reverse aging,
cure chronic diseases,
and have cracked the code
to living longer.
They have tools now
to get everywhere,
whether it's on TikTok,
which is particularly bad,
or Instagram.
There's so much bad information
that it becomes a toxic stew,
and the really good information
gets drowned.
- I got salmon sperm
injected into my face.
- Ever heard of drinking
hydrogen peroxide for health?
- Certain things we'll find
Well, doesn't really hurt,
doesn't really help,
but it costs a lot of money.
Okay, if you want to do it,
knock yourself out.
- Snails are known
to produce collagen.
- Certain things
are very dangerous.
Certain things you should think
about doing
that you
may not have considered.
Certain things we don't know
a lot about yet,
but we're starting to see
really promising signs.
- All right,
I'm gonna close this.
- Oh, my fucking God.
So the real questions
are obvious ones
no one making money
wants to answer.
- Keep those feet moving.
- I know. I'm going faster.
What longevity trends
are grounded in science,
and what's just vibes
with a subscription fee?
♪
And which of these
so-called longevity hacks
are only for the ultra-wealthy
versus anything
normal people can afford?
I'm Kara Swisher,
and I'm stoked!
I just ran and worked out,
and I'm drinking kefir.
- Yeah, I'm Scott Galloway.
I did none of those things.
- Scott Galloway spends
more money than anyone I know
on longevity treatments.
- I take supplements.
I'm on vitamin D, fish oils,
NAD treatments,
both intravenous and capsules.
I do have a Tonal, or the
equivalent of a Tonal,
and amp.
I am on testosterone therapy
and have been for a few years.
- He's done
just about everything.
I'm gonna put some
shrimp-semen lotion on my face.
That's what I'm doing, and I'm
gonna bring some back for you.
But he hasn't done this.
[calming mysterious music
playing]
[person singing
in native language]
♪
- Let your body find
the rhythm of the music,
and the music is gonna do
the work for you.
- Music has never
really impacted me
in the way it has others,
and I've always envied people
who it does.
- Kara, I wouldn't be worried
you're not that into music.
It just means your soul is void
of creativity and joy.
- [laughs]
- But I wouldn't overthink it.
- Ah!
- Focus on your breathing, and
I'll see you on the other side.
- This space-like bed is
called the SAVA Sound Pod,
and it's designed
to immerse you in the music.
It features
built-in surround sound
with four speakers
around the head
and ten powerful bass units
beneath the body
for deep, full-body vibration.
An app curates a custom playlist
with themes
like Calm and Create.
The music is generated
from original recordings
of nature and ancestral music
from around the world.
And it only costs about
Cha-ching
$25,000 for your own home pod.
♪
- Now you want to use this time
to reconnect your breath.
- [snoring]
- I think he's asleep.
[chuckles] Finally.
Stopped him talking.
Hi, honey.
- Hi, sweetheart.
- [chuckles]
- How are you guys feeling?
- I liked that. That was cool.
The music was quite surrounding,
which is sort of
like being in one
of those great movie theaters
where you don't know
- Yeah.
- There's something behind you.
- Well, the ultimate goal here
was we needed to take you
out of your body and take
your nervous system
from fight or flight, in that
kind of sympathetic state,
and then bringing you down
into the parasympathetic state,
which is the rest
and recovery state.
- They say that
the state of calm
allows the body
to repair tissues,
boost immune function,
and optimize digestion.
- Did you notice
how the spatial
- I didn't know
where it was coming from.
Ray Kelly is the inventor
of the sound pod
and an injury rehab expert.
He calls this
vibroacoustic therapy
Specific frequencies
and vibrations
that he claims can heal
your brain and nervous system.
[cups clinking]
I'm not convinced music
has that kind of power,
even if it definitely
was a stress reliever.
- All the money you're spending
on supplements, all the money
you're going
to the gym and doctor,
if you're in a state of stress,
your body's not gonna be able
to repair,
and you're not gonna be able to
perform, and it just compounds.
- Is there any peer-review
research on the benefits
of sound therapy?
- We're working with everyone
from, like, the UFC
to U.S. Soccer,
Ohio State Universities.
We have research programs
underway right now
with the U.S. Air Force,
specifically studying SAVA
for soldiers, pilots,
and people that are under
really high levels of stress.
And what we've already seen
is that we can change
the state of your nervous
system within 22 minutes.
We've seen papers
that have already shown
that chronic aches and pains
will diminish
for about 60% of test users.
When you're having claims
around lowering
people's nervous system,
you can get caught
in the woo-woo basket
very quickly,
So it was really important
- There's a basket of woo-woo?
- There's a big basket, yeah.
- Yeah.
- And so what we wanted to do
is make sure that everything
that we do is grounded
in research first,
but, ultimately,
balancing scientific knowledge
but with ancestral wisdom.
Every Indigenous culture
on the planet
has used sound
and music and song
as a way to heal their
communities for generations.
- While promising,
published studies
on vibroacoustic sound
are based on small test groups,
so more time and research
are needed to confirm
its true potential.
- This feels, to me,
like the gift
for the billionaire
who has everything.
I'm very into this stuff.
I spend a lot of time
and an extraordinary amount
of money
from the industrial complex
that's popped up here
to tap into wealthy people who
think they're not gonna die.
I mean, there's a lot
of money in this.
- Right.
- And I fall for all of it.
I would be shocked if I spend
less than five
or ten grand a month
on longevity-related stuff.
- You look marvelous.
- Yeah, don't I?
- Yeah.
- Not bad for 83.
- Scott made his fortune
in the tech industry,
so he has the resources
to spend
up to 100 grand per year
on things
like medical treatments,
wellness retreats,
and nutritional supplements.
- Biology is undefeated.
I'm trying to figure out a way,
not to beat it
but to beat it back.
It's relaxing, so at a minimum,
it's a nice way
to spend a half an hour.
- The bigger question is
whether the rest of us
can afford to fight biology
at all.
While I appreciate and even
cheer on Scott's longing
to stay young, I need
a more skeptical guide
to help navigate
this minefield of wellness.
What's the craziest one
you've heard?
Wellness getaway?
- The thing that I find craziest
are just the sheer volume
of colonics.
I mean, I got, like,
one colonic for the book,
and it was, like,
the longest subway ride
of my life going home.
[laughter]
I was like, oh, God.
- Amy Larocca is
an award-winning journalist
and author
of "How to Be Well"
A brutally honest chronicle
of subjecting herself
to the wildest, weirdest,
and occasionally wonderful
world of wellness treatments.
- Different sectors are
just being added to wellness
all the time because it is
such an incredibly powerful
marketing buzzword.
- And the word they're using
is "wellness."
- It's not "health."
It's "wellness."
- If anyone can separate
the science from the nonsense,
it's her, especially after
that pricey sound bath,
which, if nothing else,
clarified how blurry
the line has become.
- It can be incredibly dangerous
for a society to treat health
as a luxury item,
using the same tactics
and the same language
they use to sell lipstick.
- Right.
- A lot of people do want
to live forever,
but they don't think
of the consequences
of what that means
for themselves
or for anybody else
or for society at large.
And that's why, of course,
Silicon Valley people love it,
because it has
total consequences
which they ignore completely.
A lot of these guys and
they're all guys, mostly guys
Got interested in life extension
because they think everything
is a computer, which it's not.
You can hack it.
And so they love the idea
of body hacking.
They go on about their
fasting regimen or Soylent
or one more supplement
or whatever nonsense
they come up with.
But, you know, initially,
I'm like, ugh, the narcissists.
Of course they're thinking
like this,
because they're narcissists,
for the most part.
Then there are
the people making money
off the obsession
No surprise there either
Mostly men.
- With the Longevity Mix,
I take eight pills,
which are suitable
for all ages and genders.
- Their customers, though,
are overwhelmingly women.
- Add the collagen
to my matcha every single day,
and I also use their creatine
for cognitive function.
- So what does
the consumer side look like?
With Amy Larocca,
I gained access
to one of the most exclusive
wellness clubs
in New York City
The Continuum Club.
Here, the wealthy chase youth
through data diagnostics
and designer treatments.
Everything's personalized,
optimized,
and backed, supposedly,
by science.
That is, if you can swing
the $25K to $100K
annual membership
and get approval to join.
First up,
the hyperbaric oxygen chamber.
- This is your chamber.
- Oh, wow.
The iron lung. Wow.
- It does look
like an iron lung.
- It does.
The treatment involves
breathing 100% pure oxygen
at higher-than-normal
air pressure,
allegedly to deliver it into
areas with poor blood flow.
- Anytime I have something
wrong with me,
I get in there,
I just feel just better.
- Joe Rogan swears by it.
And, of course, Bryan Johnson,
the tech mogul
who's made a career
out of trying to live forever,
has his own souped-up chamber.
Oh, my God, you've got, like,
a Cadillac of hyperbaric cha
How often do you go
in this thing?
- Daily.
- I mean, what could go wrong?
- This is great
for wound healing,
addressing inflammation.
- Mm-hmm.
- Clinically, this is used
as a treatment for recovery
from traumatic brain injury
- Right.
- Stroke
- I had one of those.
- Well, then you might know.
- Okay. Okay.
- All right,
I'm gonna close this.
- Oh, my fucking God.
[chamber beeping]
- You didn't take any fentanyl
today, did you?
- Not today.
Oh.
- I'm turning on that
and the oxygenator, right?
- Oh, yeah.
I feel it in my ears.
- We're slowly climbing here.
- Oh, I can feel the ears.
- You got it.
So this level is gonna get
up to about 25.
That's 1.3 times
current atmospheric pressure.
- So I'm doing, like,
a Jeff Bezos, Katy Perry
kind of thing, right?
- Kind of.
- Not really.
- Not really.
- Not quite as ridiculous.
Hello, Amy. Thanks
for dragging me into this.
- [laughs]
- So you did
all these things, right?
- I've done
all these things, yeah.
But this is like
a sort of Rolls Royce.
- Of hyperbaric chambers?
- Yeah, this is nice.
- 'Cause I'm a classy dame.
But go ahead.
- [laughs] Yeah, exactly.
- How do they measure
something like this?
Just I feel okay?
- How you feeling?
You feeling better?
- I feel the same.
I don't know.
- Do you feel smarter?
'Cause we were out there,
and they were like,
I feel so much sharper
when I go in there.
Are you feeling sharper?
Your answers,
are they getting, like
- I think I'm sharp
all the time, Amy.
[air hissing]
Nosferatu is emerging to
- [laughs]
Oh, my God,
you look like a child.
- You're next.
- All right, I'm going.
Do you feel different?
- Uh, no.
- I'm gonna close this.
You're good to go?
- I'm good to go.
- All right.
Oxygen on.
[air hissing]
- It's a little torture chamber.
Don't you think?
- This is great.
- Do you think something like
this would lengthen your life
if you did it regularly?
- Really, what I learned
writing this book
is we're talking
about, like, the cream
on top of the milk here.
- Right.
- Health care
is so fucked in America
- Yes.
- That if you're in a position
to be a member of this club,
that probably means
you have excellent health care,
you have an excellent diet,
you have time
for leisure in your life.
If you get sick,
you can afford the medication.
- Right.
- So all of this stuff
that we're talking about
when we talk
about this level of wellness
- Right.
- Is not the stuff
that's extending your life.
- Right.
- What's extending your life
is the fact that you don't live
in a cancer cluster.
- So this cream is trying
to even go beyond that.
You know, one of the things
- Sure.
It's extra health, right?
- Extra health, longer health.
- It's trying to take you
to the next level.
- "Health span" is something
I hear from so many.
- Health span, that's right.
Really, what we're
talking about is,
what's the quality
of those extra years
that we've already got?
- So, if something like
extra oxygen would make
you have no dementia,
everyone should do it, right?
- Yeah, but I would argue
that the changes are on such
a more fundamental level
that have to do
with privilege already.
- Right.
Which is wealth.
Which is why the cream are
the ones pushing it so hard,
- [laughing] That's right.
- But often, when
the wealthy people do things,
they do trickle-down, right?
- For sure.
You know, it's
"The Devil Wears Prada."
It's the cerulean blue sweater.
- Yeah.
- I mean, if you look at
the kind of wellness offerings
that are available
on the more sort of mall level,
it's kind of astonishing.
- Increasingly, wellness has
moved beyond the ultra-wealthy
and has found its way
onto store shelves
and into our social-media feeds.
We're all Anne Hathaway
wearing our knock-off
cerulean blue sweaters.
[electronic music]
- Try a 24-hour cleanse.
- If you can't afford
good health,
you can at least buy
the illusion of good health
being peddled by your
lifestyle guru of choice.
- Beauty starts with what
we eat, how we supplement.
- Buy the pill, the powder,
the supplement
if you want that youthful glow,
or so they claim.
- Ready to go.
- You made a parallel
between the wellness industry
and the fashion industry, but
one of the things you wrote
was, "it was almost like women
were being sold
their own bodies
back to themselves."
- Oh, I think
about that all the time.
And one of the things that sort
of like keeps me awake at night
is trying to identify why.
- Why.
Ah, shrimp semen, of course.
- [laughs] Yes.
- [laughs]
- It's branding. It's branding.
Why, when you smack
the wellness label on,
ideas about rarity
and exclusivity and status,
being special
- You're in on a secret.
- You know a little something.
And when you start looking
into the history of wellness,
before we had television,
the traveling medical roadshow
would come to town.
And it would promise
all sorts of
- Right, the liver
Here's the liver.
- Snake oil, the cocaine.
- [sniffing]
- Yeah, that's an old one.
Even Betty Boop
had her own elixir.
[upbeat music]
The celebrity
and the elixir is not new.
- Numerous celebs
have launched or backed
wellness companies
selling products,
from skin care and nutrition
to fitness and mental health.
- The way that health works
in America
and the way that health care
works in America,
you don't get a lot of time
with your doctor.
But you get a lot
of time with Oprah.
"The Oprah Winfrey Show"
- Welcome!
- It became a lot of people's
stand-in health go-to resource.
She was having doctors on
- Dr. Oz is here to help us.
- Giving medical advice.
- We know it's very effective
in reducing heart disease.
We think it might actually
reduce wrinkles.
- And I really had my aha moment
when I wrote a piece about
the marketing of menopause.
- Today we're talking about
what my friend Maria Shriver
and I call "the Big M."
- The Big M.
- The Big M, Menopause.
- I was invited to go speak
with Oprah
- Stand up, Amy.
- And Gayle and Maria Shriver
and Drew Barrymore
and a bunch of, you know,
menopause-y people.
- [laughs]
"Menopause-y."
- In addition
to 100 Oprah superfans
of menopausal age
from the Tri-State Area.
And the topic was
hormone-replacement therapy.
- The doctors they said,
you need hormones.
You need hormones.
It's gonna change your life.
- If you had gone
into the Hearst Tower that day,
you would have just,
like, slathered your body
in hormones, HRT,
and expected it
to, like, drive you home,
given you a massage,
and, like, done your dishes.
- Menopause isn't just
a life stage anymore.
It's a market opportunity.
- For women who want
to take their health
into their own hands.
- You still have to Zoom
with a medical professional
to get HRT,
but you don't have to go
to your doctor's office anymore.
I'm on hormone-replacement
therapy,
yes, but you should talk
to your doctor about it.
Some of it works
for some people.
Some of it doesn't.
But that's too hard
a message for people, right?
That it's complex.
The minute you say it's complex,
they can't boil it down
to a television show.
I listen to my doctor,
and I trust my doctor.
And we debate it, and she sent
me all kinds of studies.
I read them.
I was an informed consumer
about the issue.
- What you hope is that people
are gonna call their doctors
and then have meaningful
conversations, saying,
is this right for me?
How could this work for me?
- Right.
- And to consider you, Kara
- Right.
- And your specific set of
- Issues.
- Issues and needs and
set reasonable expectations.
- Right.
- Figure out, really,
what's gonna work for you.
What you don't want
is a for-profit
- Trying to sell you
- Entity trying to sell it
to you online
without ever meeting you
and talking to you.
- Which is where it's going.
- Which is where it's going.
- All right, thank you.
This is a red-light mask.
See?
Look, red lights.
Allegedly will make
you look like Bebe.
They can go anywhere
from just 50 bucks or less
to thousands of dollars.
[light music]
I feel ridiculous.
Anyway, it's weird.
But forget this strange
and somewhat scary mask.
I'm going for the full-body
red-light experience
with my guide, Amy.
This looks another
scary, coffin-like situ
What's with the coffin?
Whoa!
Oh.
- I got to get my goggles on.
- Oh, wow.
We would presume to be naked,
but, thankfully,
we're not at this moment.
- Yeah, I mean, maybe, like, in
your underpants or something.
- Right.
- Are you comfy?
- I feel like I'm in, like,
an air fryer, but, sure.
- [laughs]
- Yeah.
So what is this for?
- I've heard red light described
as a cure for everything.
- Everything.
- If you don't want
a crepey neck, do this.
- If you want to improve
mitochondrial function
- If you care about aging
- Aged hands, bald spots
- Metabolism, et cetera
- This is for you.
- Inflammation.
- Right.
- Chronic disease
- Problems with your parents.
- Acne.
- Yeah.
- [laughing] Problems with your
parents, your tax bill.
- So, popular this is popular.
- This is super popular
for fine lines and wrinkles.
Most of the women I know
have some form
of a red light at home.
- Red light, like so many
high-priced treatments,
is often touted
as a miracle
anti-aging solution.
- Iron out fine lines
and wrinkles.
- They're weirdly appealing.
- You could do your podcast
with your mask on.
- Oh, I should.
And people believe in it.
- Oh, yeah, a lot of people,
in fact, say to me,
well, I know it's all bullshit,
except for the red light.
- Is it actually real
that red light helps you?
- Really, it's
an inflammation question.
And inflammation is something
that comes up a lot
in wellness.
- Yeah. They love that word.
- Inflammation is bad, and
reducing inflammation is good.
- Inflammation is
the body's natural response
to injury or infection.
While short-term inflammation
causes redness, heat,
swelling, and pain to protect
and heal tissue,
chronic inflammation
can damage cells
and is linked to diseases
like arthritis, heart disease,
and autoimmune conditions.
What's the actual scien
What is the conceit here?
- Is that the waves
- Mm-hmm.
- Are getting in there
and frying all the bad things.
- In the 1990s,
NASA originally began
experimenting with red light.
It found that it not only
stimulated plant growth
in space but also
sped up the healing
of wounds in astronauts.
Researchers discovered
that red light
stimulates mitochondria,
energizing cells
to repair themselves
and calming inflammation
throughout the body.
Additional recent studies
beyond NASA
showed that red-light therapy
has solid evidence
for helping thinning hair
and improving skin texture
and wrinkles.
However, most other claims,
like boosting
athletic performance,
relieving pain,
or curing disease,
need more research.
But that doesn't stop people
from selling it
as a cure for everything.
- Look, I don't know.
Am I reducing
my chronic inflammation,
my fine lines and wrinkles?
Who knows?
You're just kind of trying
to prove a negative, right?
- Right.
- But if it makes you feel
like you've kind of planted
your stake in the ground
and said,
I am putting up a fight
against this thing
that's making me feel
helpless or hopeless,
maybe that's
- Good enough.
So, again, inflammation,
fine lines, calming down.
- Sometimes I think
the biggest benefit
of some of these
wellness protocols
is less the light,
and it's just
the act of relaxing.
- Right.
- And I would come
in here, right,
in this nice,
like, toasty machine,
just chilling out in the middle
of the day, lying down.
It's, like, warm.
It's quiet.
I don't have my phone.
I don't have laptop.
The idea that you're unplugged
while simultaneously
doing something beneficial
is just
a really relaxing feeling.
It's a very increasingly rare
feeling
- Right.
- In the modern world.
It's taking a virtuous time-out
from your phone.
- Right, life-lengthening.
So how long do we stay in here?
I feel cooked.
Do you feel your fine lines
are going?
- I mean, we're gonna come
out here looking like Bebe.
- Really?
- Do you feel different?
- No.
- No.
- Oh, we're done.
- [laughs]
- All the things
you did in the book, right,
you said you don't really do
them anymore.
Is there one
that you really liked
and one that you're like,
this is bullshit?
- I really, really, really am
into the whole cult of sleep.
This culture of, like,
a successful person
is a well-rested person
- Which is true
from many studies.
- Yeah, I'm very pro that.
- Mm-hmm.
- I'm really not into, like,
the commodification
Trying to, like, sell you
your sleep.
- Sleep has become
another Internet marketplace
where algorithms reward
the loudest claims,
and everyone's trying
to monetize your exhaustion.
- Ensure that we're not being
blasted with blue light
- There's actually
a military-proven technique
to fall asleep
in exactly two minutes.
- Give tart cherry juice a try.
- Listening
to delta binaural beats
while you sleep has been shown
to increase the amount of time
you spend in deep sleep.
- A revolutionary
sleep optimization program,
Sleep Lab should be a new era
in complete restoration.
- $1,700-a-night
Equinox Sleep Lab
is a prime example
of just how far
commodification can go.
This just looks like
a regular hotel room.
But this is considered
as just a room, right?
- It's sort of all
ultra-temperature-controlled,
auto-regulated, light-regulated.
Bed is thermal-regulated.
We've got brain stimulation,
should you want it.
There's steam in the shower
to kind of warm you up,
so you cool down
so you fall asleep.
- Wow. That's a lot of activity
for just sleeping.
- Yeah, it is a bit
- Yeah.
Anything else you have here?
It's, like, Xanax in the air.
- Yeah. [laughs]
- Spray Xanax.
Dr. Matthew Walker,
one of the best known minds
in sleep science, partnered
with Equinox to design
these turbocharged sleep rooms,
as well as a headband
that stimulates your brain
for better sleep.
And today he's the person
I happen to find myself
in bed with.
- This is really where
your deep-sleep-generating
regions are.
- The future of sleep
is all very cutting-edge
and data-driven
or, you know, maybe
just a very expensive way
to take a nap.
Oh, it just talked to me.
Sorry, I pushed the button.
- Yeah, don't worry.
The shorter your sleep,
the shorter your life.
Short sleep predicts
all-cause mortality.
- Many claim that Dr. Walker's
work reframes sleep
as the key to longevity
and eternal youth.
- Diabetes,
cardiovascular disease,
dementia, depression, anxiety,
reproductive hormonal health,
immune function
Decimated by insufficient sleep.
Sleep is probably
nature's best effort yet
at immortality.
- Dr. Walker is right
about the importance of sleep,
but something that everyone
can do in their home
has, of course, been sold
back to you.
- This video is for all
of my Oura Ring girlies
who love checking
all of your scores.
- Why simply go to sleep
when you can stay up
and research sleep products
like the Oura Ring?
I never look at the Oura.
I don't know why I have it.
- Total amount of sleep
You're just below six hours.
We'd like to see you
north of seven.
- Finally, someone who will
tell me how well I'm sleeping
and what it's costing me.
- You essentially have
two main types of sleep
Non-rapid-eye-movement sleep,
or non-REM,
and then
rapid-eye-movement sleep.
REM sleep is the principal
stage within which we dream.
You are doing exceptionally
well with your REM sleep.
- I dream a lot.
Last night I had a dream that
Mark Zuckerberg poisoned me
with polonium, but that said
[chuckles]
It was a good dream.
- Mark and I spoke
about two nights ago,
and we did actually
an "Inception" moment
- I still don't understand
that movie, but go ahead.
- Non-REM is further subdivided
into light non-REM
and then deep non-REM.
And deep non-REM is where
a lot of that restoration
of body processes happen.
It's where the brain
cleanses itself.
- Like a garbage truck or
- Like a garbage truck.
And two of the pieces
of metabolic detritus
that your sleep will wash away
from the brain at night
Beta amyloid and tau protein,
the culprits of Alzheimer's.
- Right.
- Only 3% deep sleep.
There's just
this little segment.
So, within the next year,
you'll pass away.
- [chuckles]
So why has sleep become
an issue for so many people?
- There is a royal roadblock
to good sleep
stress and anxiety.
And we see this at my
sleep center all the time.
It's called the tired
but wired phenomenon.
Our head hits the pillow, and
the Rolodex of anxiety begins.
- Right.
- When you start to ruminate,
you catastrophize.
You're dead in the water
for the next two hours.
Cortisol is high.
Blood pressure
is starting to go up.
That feeds back up to the brain
and starts to say
the body is stressed.
[alarm beeping]
- Are fears about sleep
overblown, do you think?
Or do you
I don't think you do,
because you're
a sleep scientist.
- If you understand
how sleep works
Especially in Silicon Valley,
there is this
competitive under-sleeping
- Oh, yeah.
- This braggadocio
that people would wear
their badge
of sleep deprivation.
- They hustle more Elon Musk.
- Correct. Exactly.
- It was like
a sleep machismo attitude.
- Yeah, there is, yeah.
In fact, Elon one time was like,
I'm sleeping at the office.
I go, there's a hotel
next door with a bed.
He's like, yeah, but
it shows my commitment.
I said, it shows you're stupid,
is what I think.
- Yeah, one area that's
most sensitive to sleep
is the thing that makes us
most human.
It's called your
prefrontal cortex.
And it takes a nosedive
like a dart into the ground
when you are under-slept.
- Mm-hmm. Empathy.
- Empathy,
rational decision making,
executive control,
regulation of our emotions.
Essentially, without a frontal
lobe, you're a two-year-old.
- And welcome to that.
- [laughs]
- You look great.
- Yeah.
- How are you staying
in shape these days?
- Well, that's Ozempic.
- Oh.
- GLP-1s were developed
to fight type 2 diabetes,
but a side effect
Tremendous weight loss
Caught the attention
of the rich and famous.
- Mounjaro that's what I use.
- Yeah.
- One opponent
I could not defeat.
- Celebs and wealthy people
started paying their way
to weight loss,
driving up the cost for those
who actually needed it.
And it ignited
a wider discussion
about the ethical
and social implication
of using these drugs
for appearance,
rather than medical necessity.
So I sat down with one of
the country's leading experts
on the matter,
Dr. David Kessler,
former FDA head
and himself a GLP-1 user,
and Dr. Supriya Rao,
who combines
a lifestyle-focused approach
with GLP-1 medications.
GLP-1s.
- Right.
- Highly effective.
- Landmark medication
of our lifetime.
- So every doctor
I talk to has said this.
It started off
as a rich person's thing.
Why was that a bad thing?
Or was it or not?
Because if celebrities you
know, there was lots of joking.
- The celebrity thing,
unfortunately, gave it a stigma
that people didn't want to be
on it, because they're like,
oh, you're on Ozempic
just to lose 5 pounds
or for cosmetic reasons to fit
into a dress for the Met Gala.
Whereas, for me, it's like,
all the other patients
who use it
for metabolic disease.
- Most things around weight
is thought of
as a willpower issue.
- These drugs work
through pharmacology.
They work through biology.
So they show us
this is not about willpower.
Go back thousands of years.
Our brains evolved
in an environment of scarcity.
Your ability to find food
was tied to your survival.
And all these circuits just
evolved
to find that highly caloric
density food.
- And so those hyperpalatable
foods
That fat, that sugar,
that salt
Hits those happy receptors
in our brain,
our dopamine that makes us
happy in that moment.
- And all these circuits
just evolved
so that we would survive
when there was no food around.
That worked in an environment
of scarcity.
It does not work
in an environment of abundance.
When you take fat,
sugar, and salt,
put it on every corner,
make it available 24-7,
all of a sudden, that
food noise comes into my head.
You're gonna seek out
that food and find it.
And then if I try to resist,
you see this craving.
When I had to study
for exams in med school
and I had to stay up
till 3:00 at night,
I used food that allowed me
to do that.
I would gain my weight,
and then I would lose it
repeatedly.
I've run government agencies.
I've been deans of med school.
I have discipline.
I couldn't control my weight.
- What these medications do
We're kind of artificially
allowing food to sit there
for a longer time
so you feel fuller longer.
You have the satiety cues
completed.
- Make you un-hungry.
- They get you to eat less.
- Eat less.
If even Dr. Kessler,
with medical training
and structure,
found it nearly impossible
to manage his weight
without GLP-1s,
what chance did
the average person ever have?
- I did every diet
that has been out since 1993,
since I had my kids
Jenny Craig, Weight Watchers,
LA Weight Loss.
There was an Army diet
that was about hot dogs.
Whatever, I did it.
- Yeah. Hot dogs?
- Yeah. It was a yo-yo
that kept going on and
- Cleo Laughlin,
a retired night-shift nurse,
spent decades waging
her own battle with weight.
- I was actually looking
for a psychiatrist,
thinking there was
something wrong with me
in the head that
was blocking me.
So I made the telephone call.
Next thing I know,
I had a nutritionist,
and she said, oh, we're
starting this new program.
It's basically a plant-based
diet and no processed foods.
And then at that point,
she also introduced me
to the GLP-1s.
- Cleo has lost 110 pounds.
In this case, GLP-1s
have been effective,
but the story isn't so simple.
- I wasn't a diabetic.
I didn't have
blood-pressure issues.
But I knew I was, like
a couple eyeblinks away from it.
And I didn't want to
come out of retirement
and be one of those
people that dropped dead
- Right.
- You know, a year later.
- To keep the weight off,
Cleo spent over $2,800
just last year
A huge expense
for a retired nurse.
- You know, when you go
and you get a medication
that costs $1,000
- Mm-hmm.
- And people who have
a lot of weight to lose,
they just need it,
they just need it.
It's the right thing to do.
It's part of keeping
America healthy.
I'm not saying
you have to make it free,
but make it affordable.
- Right.
- But I was listening where the
insurance company was saying,
this is going to bankrupt us
if we support these GLP-1s.
- Well, unless we bring the
prices down, which you can.
- Right.
Well, God forbid they do that.
- And a bigger concern
is long-term access,
and like many health decisions,
it doesn't just affect her
but the family
orbiting around her.
- Since I've known Cleo
35 years or so,
you know,
she never gave up on it.
And I had read a little bit
about the GLP-1 drugs.
I do think about, you know,
having to be on it, you know
- Long-term.
- Permanently, yeah
and what would happen
if you stopped taking it.
- Right.
- [chuckles] Go back to
[laughter]
Go back to the nightmare
two years ago.
[laughter]
- But we're in big trouble
as a country.
- Why is that?
- You have one industry making
billions of dollars, right,
that's making us sick
with what we're eating.
And you have another industry
that's making equal profits
trying to treat what that
former industry is doing.
Most people couldn't afford
that drug.
Health plans employers
looked at that and said,
I can't afford that.
- Even if it's saved
on the other end.
- Yeah, right, but employers
still think of it
almost as a cosmetic thing.
- Big news, America
Wegovy now comes in a pill.
- Recently, there's been
a lot of progress
in the GLP-1 world.
In early 2026,
a pill form was approved
that greatly reduced the price,
but access to better medication
doesn't automatically solve
the deeper
public-health challenge.
So you've compared it to
Big Tobacco in terms of
And that was defeated.
- Tobacco was the great
public-health success.
Obesity is the great
public-health failure.
We didn't change the cigarette.
We demonized the industry.
The problem is,
you can't demonize food.
- There's one group
that is pushing
against what you call
ultra-formulated foods
The MAHA movement.
The MAHA movement,
Make America Healthy Again,
championed by RFK, Jr.,
is pushing back
against GLP-1 drugs
by scrapping plans
for Medicare
and Medicaid coverage,
insisting that better diet
and exercise,
especially cutting out
ultra-processed foods,
are the real keys
to America's health crisis.
- Are you going to tell me
that they're gonna get rid
of all the McDonald's
and all of the fast food
- You saw the picture
of RFK, Jr. with McDonald's.
- So I'm a little dubious,
honestly.
You're working two jobs.
You're trying to make sure
your kids get to school.
You're trying to decide
what bill you have to pay.
So I think a lot
of Americans struggle
with being able to hit
all these different things
in their daily life.
All this other
lifestyle stuff just seems,
like, almost impossible.
- Extra.
- MAHA can't just be
for the wealthy.
Improving the quality
of our food is important,
but it won't matter if
the rest of the infrastructure
that's around
doesn't help everybody.
Like, trying to get rid
of GLP-1s is not the answer.
- While promising,
the long-term effects
of GLP-1 drugs
are still largely unknown.
The jury's out
on a lot of this stuff.
What's really critically
important here with GLP-1s
is we conduct studies
and we look at
the long-term effects of this,
because every single
medical intervention
has a downside.
And so it needs to be studied
in the population
over a long term.
That should be our goal.
- Abs tight.
Get it.
Get it. Get it.
- There are three clear things
we need for longevity
Eat well, good sleep,
and, of course, exercise.
- Yeah, keep going, keep going.
- Ooh!
- There you go. Yeah.
- Ow.
- Ow.
- It's inexpensive
and often free.
But the industry still finds
a way to make a buck.
This makes me slim
and girlish, right?
- Sure.
- I work out three times
a week with my trainer, J.,
mostly doing strength training.
[grunts]
But according to the Internet,
my current routine
isn't going to cut it.
All right, that's enough.
- [laughs]
- Girl, I done got me
a mini step machine,
and, yes, I am loving it.
- What I absolutely love
to use my vibration plate for
is to sit down on my plate.
- On the ground, step on.
I can literally do it
while watching Netflix.
- There have been
so many questionable
get-fit-quick products.
- What is VO2 max,
and how do you improve it?
- And something called
the VO2 max test
seems like it might be one
of those as well.
Luke, I am your father.
- You realize
no one can hear you?
This is like your nightmare.
- Ha ha. You are my nightmare.
The VO2 max test measures
how much oxygen your body
can use during intense exercise.
It's a real indicator for your
cardiovascular fitness
and longevity, not junk science.
You want me to do it
on the Apple Watch?
- Nah, that thing's
a piece of junk.
- Everyday wearables,
like Oura Rings, Fitbits,
and Apple Watches can give
you a VO2 max estimate,
but this uncomfortable test
gives you
a much more accurate reading.
- And then we're just
gonna periodically increase
the challenge.
[device beeping]
There you go.
After we get you your numbers
and we set your program up,
we'll be able to retest
in six to eight weeks
and see how effective
our program's been.
- If you increase your VO2 max
by just one point,
you can decrease, on average,
your risk of dying
from anything
Heart disease, stroke,
cancer, dementia by 10%.
VO2 max testing has been
around for a long time,
but there's been a recent
renewed interest,
as influencers
and fitness experts
publicly praise it
for longevity.
- The higher your VO2 max,
the greater health span
you have.
- Professional lab tests
at sports clinics
or high-end gyms run anywhere
from $100 to $250 a session.
And if you want to buy
your own VO2 max machine,
the range
from $5,000 to $30,000.
It's one more thing
you can spend money on
to give yourself
a supposed edge.
[rock music]
After two months of running
a few times a week,
I'm back to see
if there is any improvement.
Should there be an improvement?
- Oh, yes, definitely.
- What if there's not?
- No chance.
You ready?
- All right, let's go.
- Hold on tight.
[beeping]
♪
Just keep a nice, normal breath.
- [groans]
- This is like nothing.
It's almost downhill,
it's such a low incline.
Yeah.
I'll be nervous once
the fingers stop coming out.
- Guess what.
This 62-year-old got younger,
at least by VO2 max standards.
Whew!
- Look at all the way
down here we got some 37s.
- An average VO2 max
for women my age
would be somewhere
between 27 and 38.
Now I'm 37,
so the hard work paid off.
- Before, your heart rate
was 30 beats more a minute
- Wow.
- To process less oxygen
than you can now.
Now you're processing
37 milliliters.
So you're doing, you know,
almost a third more work
at the same heart rate.
- And that's purely
'cause I kept running,
'cause I trained my heart
to be more efficient.
- You trained your muscles
to more efficiently use oxygen.
- I see.
- You just become a stronger,
more efficient animal.
- So, "you're superior"
Say that to me.
- According to this laptop,
you are superior.
- Superior!
- Okay.
- Yeah.
This is good for me for sure,
but is it necessary?
What it is, is expensive
and probably not needed
for the masses.
Like sleep, people don't
need the bells and whistles
just to do the activity.
After testing out
the latest longevity trends,
one thing is clear
Most are either unproven,
marginally useful,
or wildly overpriced.
This is a family network.
- I do like how you still think
people can hear you.
- Mm.
VO2 max, sleep, and GLP-1 drugs
have solid evidence and impact
meaningful outcomes.
- I just feel good.
- My butt is really toasty.
- I know, really hot.
Red-light therapy
and hyperbaric chambers
may help in limited
medical contexts,
but as a consumer product,
they're mostly a luxury.
Sound or so-called
"vibe therapies"
offer relaxation.
- [snoring]
- But there's little proof
that they contribute
to longevity as yet.
- [snoring]
- If something suddenly
becomes really hot,
if you heard
about it on Instagram,
they may not be as accurate
as you might want.
If anyone says, this is
gonna change your life,
it's not gonna change your life.
Others are really promising
GLP-1s, for example.
Be a savvy consumer.
The bigger story is access.
If a longevity hack only works
if you're rich enough
to buy it,
it's not a breakthrough.
It's a lifestyle brand.
- It's, again,
branding exclusivity
- Right.
- Access.
So I think all of these things
come into play.
- Is that a satisfying way
to try to live longer?
- Um
- It feels exhausting.
- It feels really tiring, right?
- Mm-hmm.
- What are we supposed to do?
Plug stuff in that isn't
really, like, super tested?
- And no matter what you do,
you're gonna be dead someday.
- Yes.
The train has left the station,
and we're all on it.
And we're just trying
to make sense of it.
- Make it a better trip, right?
- [laughs] Yeah.
- Oh, my.
Both: Wow.
[quirky music]
- Doesn't this land
in the backyard
of a Colorado household
owned by a woman named Mindy?
[laughter]
- Mork and Mindy.
- It's a state-of-the-art
sound-therapy pod
that is using sound
playing in your body.
So there's a lot
of science-based frequencies
designed to calm your nervous
system at a cellular level.
We typically call it an inner-
and out-of-body experience.
- You know those moments
where you suddenly have
to ask yourself,
how did I end up here?
- This feels like
the lamest crypt in the world,
and I'm stuck with Kara.
- [laughs] Well,
Emily Ratajkowski was busy.
This was one of those.
I was deep inside
a concrete basement
in New York City
about to embark
on an auditory journey
that is designed to help
my body repair,
restore, and transform itself.
- We're going to take you
on a beautiful sound journey.
- Sound journey, Scott.
- All right.
- My traveling companion
was my good friend
and podcast partner,
Scott Galloway.
- I just had
a deep insight, Kara.
This longevity trend hasn't
the Earth suffered enough?
Shouldn't we just die?
- [laughs]
Oh.
[jazzy music]
One of the things
that's really disturbing,
as usual,
with the use of social media,
with all this knowledge
everywhere, Dr. Google,
everyone thinks they're
an expert, and they are not.
- When I wake up,
the first thing I do
is drink Longevity Mix.
- It's packed with CoQ10.
- I'm gonna NAD
for the rest of my life,
and I'm never gonna age.
- Social media is flooded with
celebrity wellness influencers
hawking breakthrough therapies,
claiming they reverse aging,
cure chronic diseases,
and have cracked the code
to living longer.
They have tools now
to get everywhere,
whether it's on TikTok,
which is particularly bad,
or Instagram.
There's so much bad information
that it becomes a toxic stew,
and the really good information
gets drowned.
- I got salmon sperm
injected into my face.
- Ever heard of drinking
hydrogen peroxide for health?
- Certain things we'll find
Well, doesn't really hurt,
doesn't really help,
but it costs a lot of money.
Okay, if you want to do it,
knock yourself out.
- Snails are known
to produce collagen.
- Certain things
are very dangerous.
Certain things you should think
about doing
that you
may not have considered.
Certain things we don't know
a lot about yet,
but we're starting to see
really promising signs.
- All right,
I'm gonna close this.
- Oh, my fucking God.
So the real questions
are obvious ones
no one making money
wants to answer.
- Keep those feet moving.
- I know. I'm going faster.
What longevity trends
are grounded in science,
and what's just vibes
with a subscription fee?
♪
And which of these
so-called longevity hacks
are only for the ultra-wealthy
versus anything
normal people can afford?
I'm Kara Swisher,
and I'm stoked!
I just ran and worked out,
and I'm drinking kefir.
- Yeah, I'm Scott Galloway.
I did none of those things.
- Scott Galloway spends
more money than anyone I know
on longevity treatments.
- I take supplements.
I'm on vitamin D, fish oils,
NAD treatments,
both intravenous and capsules.
I do have a Tonal, or the
equivalent of a Tonal,
and amp.
I am on testosterone therapy
and have been for a few years.
- He's done
just about everything.
I'm gonna put some
shrimp-semen lotion on my face.
That's what I'm doing, and I'm
gonna bring some back for you.
But he hasn't done this.
[calming mysterious music
playing]
[person singing
in native language]
♪
- Let your body find
the rhythm of the music,
and the music is gonna do
the work for you.
- Music has never
really impacted me
in the way it has others,
and I've always envied people
who it does.
- Kara, I wouldn't be worried
you're not that into music.
It just means your soul is void
of creativity and joy.
- [laughs]
- But I wouldn't overthink it.
- Ah!
- Focus on your breathing, and
I'll see you on the other side.
- This space-like bed is
called the SAVA Sound Pod,
and it's designed
to immerse you in the music.
It features
built-in surround sound
with four speakers
around the head
and ten powerful bass units
beneath the body
for deep, full-body vibration.
An app curates a custom playlist
with themes
like Calm and Create.
The music is generated
from original recordings
of nature and ancestral music
from around the world.
And it only costs about
Cha-ching
$25,000 for your own home pod.
♪
- Now you want to use this time
to reconnect your breath.
- [snoring]
- I think he's asleep.
[chuckles] Finally.
Stopped him talking.
Hi, honey.
- Hi, sweetheart.
- [chuckles]
- How are you guys feeling?
- I liked that. That was cool.
The music was quite surrounding,
which is sort of
like being in one
of those great movie theaters
where you don't know
- Yeah.
- There's something behind you.
- Well, the ultimate goal here
was we needed to take you
out of your body and take
your nervous system
from fight or flight, in that
kind of sympathetic state,
and then bringing you down
into the parasympathetic state,
which is the rest
and recovery state.
- They say that
the state of calm
allows the body
to repair tissues,
boost immune function,
and optimize digestion.
- Did you notice
how the spatial
- I didn't know
where it was coming from.
Ray Kelly is the inventor
of the sound pod
and an injury rehab expert.
He calls this
vibroacoustic therapy
Specific frequencies
and vibrations
that he claims can heal
your brain and nervous system.
[cups clinking]
I'm not convinced music
has that kind of power,
even if it definitely
was a stress reliever.
- All the money you're spending
on supplements, all the money
you're going
to the gym and doctor,
if you're in a state of stress,
your body's not gonna be able
to repair,
and you're not gonna be able to
perform, and it just compounds.
- Is there any peer-review
research on the benefits
of sound therapy?
- We're working with everyone
from, like, the UFC
to U.S. Soccer,
Ohio State Universities.
We have research programs
underway right now
with the U.S. Air Force,
specifically studying SAVA
for soldiers, pilots,
and people that are under
really high levels of stress.
And what we've already seen
is that we can change
the state of your nervous
system within 22 minutes.
We've seen papers
that have already shown
that chronic aches and pains
will diminish
for about 60% of test users.
When you're having claims
around lowering
people's nervous system,
you can get caught
in the woo-woo basket
very quickly,
So it was really important
- There's a basket of woo-woo?
- There's a big basket, yeah.
- Yeah.
- And so what we wanted to do
is make sure that everything
that we do is grounded
in research first,
but, ultimately,
balancing scientific knowledge
but with ancestral wisdom.
Every Indigenous culture
on the planet
has used sound
and music and song
as a way to heal their
communities for generations.
- While promising,
published studies
on vibroacoustic sound
are based on small test groups,
so more time and research
are needed to confirm
its true potential.
- This feels, to me,
like the gift
for the billionaire
who has everything.
I'm very into this stuff.
I spend a lot of time
and an extraordinary amount
of money
from the industrial complex
that's popped up here
to tap into wealthy people who
think they're not gonna die.
I mean, there's a lot
of money in this.
- Right.
- And I fall for all of it.
I would be shocked if I spend
less than five
or ten grand a month
on longevity-related stuff.
- You look marvelous.
- Yeah, don't I?
- Yeah.
- Not bad for 83.
- Scott made his fortune
in the tech industry,
so he has the resources
to spend
up to 100 grand per year
on things
like medical treatments,
wellness retreats,
and nutritional supplements.
- Biology is undefeated.
I'm trying to figure out a way,
not to beat it
but to beat it back.
It's relaxing, so at a minimum,
it's a nice way
to spend a half an hour.
- The bigger question is
whether the rest of us
can afford to fight biology
at all.
While I appreciate and even
cheer on Scott's longing
to stay young, I need
a more skeptical guide
to help navigate
this minefield of wellness.
What's the craziest one
you've heard?
Wellness getaway?
- The thing that I find craziest
are just the sheer volume
of colonics.
I mean, I got, like,
one colonic for the book,
and it was, like,
the longest subway ride
of my life going home.
[laughter]
I was like, oh, God.
- Amy Larocca is
an award-winning journalist
and author
of "How to Be Well"
A brutally honest chronicle
of subjecting herself
to the wildest, weirdest,
and occasionally wonderful
world of wellness treatments.
- Different sectors are
just being added to wellness
all the time because it is
such an incredibly powerful
marketing buzzword.
- And the word they're using
is "wellness."
- It's not "health."
It's "wellness."
- If anyone can separate
the science from the nonsense,
it's her, especially after
that pricey sound bath,
which, if nothing else,
clarified how blurry
the line has become.
- It can be incredibly dangerous
for a society to treat health
as a luxury item,
using the same tactics
and the same language
they use to sell lipstick.
- Right.
- A lot of people do want
to live forever,
but they don't think
of the consequences
of what that means
for themselves
or for anybody else
or for society at large.
And that's why, of course,
Silicon Valley people love it,
because it has
total consequences
which they ignore completely.
A lot of these guys and
they're all guys, mostly guys
Got interested in life extension
because they think everything
is a computer, which it's not.
You can hack it.
And so they love the idea
of body hacking.
They go on about their
fasting regimen or Soylent
or one more supplement
or whatever nonsense
they come up with.
But, you know, initially,
I'm like, ugh, the narcissists.
Of course they're thinking
like this,
because they're narcissists,
for the most part.
Then there are
the people making money
off the obsession
No surprise there either
Mostly men.
- With the Longevity Mix,
I take eight pills,
which are suitable
for all ages and genders.
- Their customers, though,
are overwhelmingly women.
- Add the collagen
to my matcha every single day,
and I also use their creatine
for cognitive function.
- So what does
the consumer side look like?
With Amy Larocca,
I gained access
to one of the most exclusive
wellness clubs
in New York City
The Continuum Club.
Here, the wealthy chase youth
through data diagnostics
and designer treatments.
Everything's personalized,
optimized,
and backed, supposedly,
by science.
That is, if you can swing
the $25K to $100K
annual membership
and get approval to join.
First up,
the hyperbaric oxygen chamber.
- This is your chamber.
- Oh, wow.
The iron lung. Wow.
- It does look
like an iron lung.
- It does.
The treatment involves
breathing 100% pure oxygen
at higher-than-normal
air pressure,
allegedly to deliver it into
areas with poor blood flow.
- Anytime I have something
wrong with me,
I get in there,
I just feel just better.
- Joe Rogan swears by it.
And, of course, Bryan Johnson,
the tech mogul
who's made a career
out of trying to live forever,
has his own souped-up chamber.
Oh, my God, you've got, like,
a Cadillac of hyperbaric cha
How often do you go
in this thing?
- Daily.
- I mean, what could go wrong?
- This is great
for wound healing,
addressing inflammation.
- Mm-hmm.
- Clinically, this is used
as a treatment for recovery
from traumatic brain injury
- Right.
- Stroke
- I had one of those.
- Well, then you might know.
- Okay. Okay.
- All right,
I'm gonna close this.
- Oh, my fucking God.
[chamber beeping]
- You didn't take any fentanyl
today, did you?
- Not today.
Oh.
- I'm turning on that
and the oxygenator, right?
- Oh, yeah.
I feel it in my ears.
- We're slowly climbing here.
- Oh, I can feel the ears.
- You got it.
So this level is gonna get
up to about 25.
That's 1.3 times
current atmospheric pressure.
- So I'm doing, like,
a Jeff Bezos, Katy Perry
kind of thing, right?
- Kind of.
- Not really.
- Not really.
- Not quite as ridiculous.
Hello, Amy. Thanks
for dragging me into this.
- [laughs]
- So you did
all these things, right?
- I've done
all these things, yeah.
But this is like
a sort of Rolls Royce.
- Of hyperbaric chambers?
- Yeah, this is nice.
- 'Cause I'm a classy dame.
But go ahead.
- [laughs] Yeah, exactly.
- How do they measure
something like this?
Just I feel okay?
- How you feeling?
You feeling better?
- I feel the same.
I don't know.
- Do you feel smarter?
'Cause we were out there,
and they were like,
I feel so much sharper
when I go in there.
Are you feeling sharper?
Your answers,
are they getting, like
- I think I'm sharp
all the time, Amy.
[air hissing]
Nosferatu is emerging to
- [laughs]
Oh, my God,
you look like a child.
- You're next.
- All right, I'm going.
Do you feel different?
- Uh, no.
- I'm gonna close this.
You're good to go?
- I'm good to go.
- All right.
Oxygen on.
[air hissing]
- It's a little torture chamber.
Don't you think?
- This is great.
- Do you think something like
this would lengthen your life
if you did it regularly?
- Really, what I learned
writing this book
is we're talking
about, like, the cream
on top of the milk here.
- Right.
- Health care
is so fucked in America
- Yes.
- That if you're in a position
to be a member of this club,
that probably means
you have excellent health care,
you have an excellent diet,
you have time
for leisure in your life.
If you get sick,
you can afford the medication.
- Right.
- So all of this stuff
that we're talking about
when we talk
about this level of wellness
- Right.
- Is not the stuff
that's extending your life.
- Right.
- What's extending your life
is the fact that you don't live
in a cancer cluster.
- So this cream is trying
to even go beyond that.
You know, one of the things
- Sure.
It's extra health, right?
- Extra health, longer health.
- It's trying to take you
to the next level.
- "Health span" is something
I hear from so many.
- Health span, that's right.
Really, what we're
talking about is,
what's the quality
of those extra years
that we've already got?
- So, if something like
extra oxygen would make
you have no dementia,
everyone should do it, right?
- Yeah, but I would argue
that the changes are on such
a more fundamental level
that have to do
with privilege already.
- Right.
Which is wealth.
Which is why the cream are
the ones pushing it so hard,
- [laughing] That's right.
- But often, when
the wealthy people do things,
they do trickle-down, right?
- For sure.
You know, it's
"The Devil Wears Prada."
It's the cerulean blue sweater.
- Yeah.
- I mean, if you look at
the kind of wellness offerings
that are available
on the more sort of mall level,
it's kind of astonishing.
- Increasingly, wellness has
moved beyond the ultra-wealthy
and has found its way
onto store shelves
and into our social-media feeds.
We're all Anne Hathaway
wearing our knock-off
cerulean blue sweaters.
[electronic music]
- Try a 24-hour cleanse.
- If you can't afford
good health,
you can at least buy
the illusion of good health
being peddled by your
lifestyle guru of choice.
- Beauty starts with what
we eat, how we supplement.
- Buy the pill, the powder,
the supplement
if you want that youthful glow,
or so they claim.
- Ready to go.
- You made a parallel
between the wellness industry
and the fashion industry, but
one of the things you wrote
was, "it was almost like women
were being sold
their own bodies
back to themselves."
- Oh, I think
about that all the time.
And one of the things that sort
of like keeps me awake at night
is trying to identify why.
- Why.
Ah, shrimp semen, of course.
- [laughs] Yes.
- [laughs]
- It's branding. It's branding.
Why, when you smack
the wellness label on,
ideas about rarity
and exclusivity and status,
being special
- You're in on a secret.
- You know a little something.
And when you start looking
into the history of wellness,
before we had television,
the traveling medical roadshow
would come to town.
And it would promise
all sorts of
- Right, the liver
Here's the liver.
- Snake oil, the cocaine.
- [sniffing]
- Yeah, that's an old one.
Even Betty Boop
had her own elixir.
[upbeat music]
The celebrity
and the elixir is not new.
- Numerous celebs
have launched or backed
wellness companies
selling products,
from skin care and nutrition
to fitness and mental health.
- The way that health works
in America
and the way that health care
works in America,
you don't get a lot of time
with your doctor.
But you get a lot
of time with Oprah.
"The Oprah Winfrey Show"
- Welcome!
- It became a lot of people's
stand-in health go-to resource.
She was having doctors on
- Dr. Oz is here to help us.
- Giving medical advice.
- We know it's very effective
in reducing heart disease.
We think it might actually
reduce wrinkles.
- And I really had my aha moment
when I wrote a piece about
the marketing of menopause.
- Today we're talking about
what my friend Maria Shriver
and I call "the Big M."
- The Big M.
- The Big M, Menopause.
- I was invited to go speak
with Oprah
- Stand up, Amy.
- And Gayle and Maria Shriver
and Drew Barrymore
and a bunch of, you know,
menopause-y people.
- [laughs]
"Menopause-y."
- In addition
to 100 Oprah superfans
of menopausal age
from the Tri-State Area.
And the topic was
hormone-replacement therapy.
- The doctors they said,
you need hormones.
You need hormones.
It's gonna change your life.
- If you had gone
into the Hearst Tower that day,
you would have just,
like, slathered your body
in hormones, HRT,
and expected it
to, like, drive you home,
given you a massage,
and, like, done your dishes.
- Menopause isn't just
a life stage anymore.
It's a market opportunity.
- For women who want
to take their health
into their own hands.
- You still have to Zoom
with a medical professional
to get HRT,
but you don't have to go
to your doctor's office anymore.
I'm on hormone-replacement
therapy,
yes, but you should talk
to your doctor about it.
Some of it works
for some people.
Some of it doesn't.
But that's too hard
a message for people, right?
That it's complex.
The minute you say it's complex,
they can't boil it down
to a television show.
I listen to my doctor,
and I trust my doctor.
And we debate it, and she sent
me all kinds of studies.
I read them.
I was an informed consumer
about the issue.
- What you hope is that people
are gonna call their doctors
and then have meaningful
conversations, saying,
is this right for me?
How could this work for me?
- Right.
- And to consider you, Kara
- Right.
- And your specific set of
- Issues.
- Issues and needs and
set reasonable expectations.
- Right.
- Figure out, really,
what's gonna work for you.
What you don't want
is a for-profit
- Trying to sell you
- Entity trying to sell it
to you online
without ever meeting you
and talking to you.
- Which is where it's going.
- Which is where it's going.
- All right, thank you.
This is a red-light mask.
See?
Look, red lights.
Allegedly will make
you look like Bebe.
They can go anywhere
from just 50 bucks or less
to thousands of dollars.
[light music]
I feel ridiculous.
Anyway, it's weird.
But forget this strange
and somewhat scary mask.
I'm going for the full-body
red-light experience
with my guide, Amy.
This looks another
scary, coffin-like situ
What's with the coffin?
Whoa!
Oh.
- I got to get my goggles on.
- Oh, wow.
We would presume to be naked,
but, thankfully,
we're not at this moment.
- Yeah, I mean, maybe, like, in
your underpants or something.
- Right.
- Are you comfy?
- I feel like I'm in, like,
an air fryer, but, sure.
- [laughs]
- Yeah.
So what is this for?
- I've heard red light described
as a cure for everything.
- Everything.
- If you don't want
a crepey neck, do this.
- If you want to improve
mitochondrial function
- If you care about aging
- Aged hands, bald spots
- Metabolism, et cetera
- This is for you.
- Inflammation.
- Right.
- Chronic disease
- Problems with your parents.
- Acne.
- Yeah.
- [laughing] Problems with your
parents, your tax bill.
- So, popular this is popular.
- This is super popular
for fine lines and wrinkles.
Most of the women I know
have some form
of a red light at home.
- Red light, like so many
high-priced treatments,
is often touted
as a miracle
anti-aging solution.
- Iron out fine lines
and wrinkles.
- They're weirdly appealing.
- You could do your podcast
with your mask on.
- Oh, I should.
And people believe in it.
- Oh, yeah, a lot of people,
in fact, say to me,
well, I know it's all bullshit,
except for the red light.
- Is it actually real
that red light helps you?
- Really, it's
an inflammation question.
And inflammation is something
that comes up a lot
in wellness.
- Yeah. They love that word.
- Inflammation is bad, and
reducing inflammation is good.
- Inflammation is
the body's natural response
to injury or infection.
While short-term inflammation
causes redness, heat,
swelling, and pain to protect
and heal tissue,
chronic inflammation
can damage cells
and is linked to diseases
like arthritis, heart disease,
and autoimmune conditions.
What's the actual scien
What is the conceit here?
- Is that the waves
- Mm-hmm.
- Are getting in there
and frying all the bad things.
- In the 1990s,
NASA originally began
experimenting with red light.
It found that it not only
stimulated plant growth
in space but also
sped up the healing
of wounds in astronauts.
Researchers discovered
that red light
stimulates mitochondria,
energizing cells
to repair themselves
and calming inflammation
throughout the body.
Additional recent studies
beyond NASA
showed that red-light therapy
has solid evidence
for helping thinning hair
and improving skin texture
and wrinkles.
However, most other claims,
like boosting
athletic performance,
relieving pain,
or curing disease,
need more research.
But that doesn't stop people
from selling it
as a cure for everything.
- Look, I don't know.
Am I reducing
my chronic inflammation,
my fine lines and wrinkles?
Who knows?
You're just kind of trying
to prove a negative, right?
- Right.
- But if it makes you feel
like you've kind of planted
your stake in the ground
and said,
I am putting up a fight
against this thing
that's making me feel
helpless or hopeless,
maybe that's
- Good enough.
So, again, inflammation,
fine lines, calming down.
- Sometimes I think
the biggest benefit
of some of these
wellness protocols
is less the light,
and it's just
the act of relaxing.
- Right.
- And I would come
in here, right,
in this nice,
like, toasty machine,
just chilling out in the middle
of the day, lying down.
It's, like, warm.
It's quiet.
I don't have my phone.
I don't have laptop.
The idea that you're unplugged
while simultaneously
doing something beneficial
is just
a really relaxing feeling.
It's a very increasingly rare
feeling
- Right.
- In the modern world.
It's taking a virtuous time-out
from your phone.
- Right, life-lengthening.
So how long do we stay in here?
I feel cooked.
Do you feel your fine lines
are going?
- I mean, we're gonna come
out here looking like Bebe.
- Really?
- Do you feel different?
- No.
- No.
- Oh, we're done.
- [laughs]
- All the things
you did in the book, right,
you said you don't really do
them anymore.
Is there one
that you really liked
and one that you're like,
this is bullshit?
- I really, really, really am
into the whole cult of sleep.
This culture of, like,
a successful person
is a well-rested person
- Which is true
from many studies.
- Yeah, I'm very pro that.
- Mm-hmm.
- I'm really not into, like,
the commodification
Trying to, like, sell you
your sleep.
- Sleep has become
another Internet marketplace
where algorithms reward
the loudest claims,
and everyone's trying
to monetize your exhaustion.
- Ensure that we're not being
blasted with blue light
- There's actually
a military-proven technique
to fall asleep
in exactly two minutes.
- Give tart cherry juice a try.
- Listening
to delta binaural beats
while you sleep has been shown
to increase the amount of time
you spend in deep sleep.
- A revolutionary
sleep optimization program,
Sleep Lab should be a new era
in complete restoration.
- $1,700-a-night
Equinox Sleep Lab
is a prime example
of just how far
commodification can go.
This just looks like
a regular hotel room.
But this is considered
as just a room, right?
- It's sort of all
ultra-temperature-controlled,
auto-regulated, light-regulated.
Bed is thermal-regulated.
We've got brain stimulation,
should you want it.
There's steam in the shower
to kind of warm you up,
so you cool down
so you fall asleep.
- Wow. That's a lot of activity
for just sleeping.
- Yeah, it is a bit
- Yeah.
Anything else you have here?
It's, like, Xanax in the air.
- Yeah. [laughs]
- Spray Xanax.
Dr. Matthew Walker,
one of the best known minds
in sleep science, partnered
with Equinox to design
these turbocharged sleep rooms,
as well as a headband
that stimulates your brain
for better sleep.
And today he's the person
I happen to find myself
in bed with.
- This is really where
your deep-sleep-generating
regions are.
- The future of sleep
is all very cutting-edge
and data-driven
or, you know, maybe
just a very expensive way
to take a nap.
Oh, it just talked to me.
Sorry, I pushed the button.
- Yeah, don't worry.
The shorter your sleep,
the shorter your life.
Short sleep predicts
all-cause mortality.
- Many claim that Dr. Walker's
work reframes sleep
as the key to longevity
and eternal youth.
- Diabetes,
cardiovascular disease,
dementia, depression, anxiety,
reproductive hormonal health,
immune function
Decimated by insufficient sleep.
Sleep is probably
nature's best effort yet
at immortality.
- Dr. Walker is right
about the importance of sleep,
but something that everyone
can do in their home
has, of course, been sold
back to you.
- This video is for all
of my Oura Ring girlies
who love checking
all of your scores.
- Why simply go to sleep
when you can stay up
and research sleep products
like the Oura Ring?
I never look at the Oura.
I don't know why I have it.
- Total amount of sleep
You're just below six hours.
We'd like to see you
north of seven.
- Finally, someone who will
tell me how well I'm sleeping
and what it's costing me.
- You essentially have
two main types of sleep
Non-rapid-eye-movement sleep,
or non-REM,
and then
rapid-eye-movement sleep.
REM sleep is the principal
stage within which we dream.
You are doing exceptionally
well with your REM sleep.
- I dream a lot.
Last night I had a dream that
Mark Zuckerberg poisoned me
with polonium, but that said
[chuckles]
It was a good dream.
- Mark and I spoke
about two nights ago,
and we did actually
an "Inception" moment
- I still don't understand
that movie, but go ahead.
- Non-REM is further subdivided
into light non-REM
and then deep non-REM.
And deep non-REM is where
a lot of that restoration
of body processes happen.
It's where the brain
cleanses itself.
- Like a garbage truck or
- Like a garbage truck.
And two of the pieces
of metabolic detritus
that your sleep will wash away
from the brain at night
Beta amyloid and tau protein,
the culprits of Alzheimer's.
- Right.
- Only 3% deep sleep.
There's just
this little segment.
So, within the next year,
you'll pass away.
- [chuckles]
So why has sleep become
an issue for so many people?
- There is a royal roadblock
to good sleep
stress and anxiety.
And we see this at my
sleep center all the time.
It's called the tired
but wired phenomenon.
Our head hits the pillow, and
the Rolodex of anxiety begins.
- Right.
- When you start to ruminate,
you catastrophize.
You're dead in the water
for the next two hours.
Cortisol is high.
Blood pressure
is starting to go up.
That feeds back up to the brain
and starts to say
the body is stressed.
[alarm beeping]
- Are fears about sleep
overblown, do you think?
Or do you
I don't think you do,
because you're
a sleep scientist.
- If you understand
how sleep works
Especially in Silicon Valley,
there is this
competitive under-sleeping
- Oh, yeah.
- This braggadocio
that people would wear
their badge
of sleep deprivation.
- They hustle more Elon Musk.
- Correct. Exactly.
- It was like
a sleep machismo attitude.
- Yeah, there is, yeah.
In fact, Elon one time was like,
I'm sleeping at the office.
I go, there's a hotel
next door with a bed.
He's like, yeah, but
it shows my commitment.
I said, it shows you're stupid,
is what I think.
- Yeah, one area that's
most sensitive to sleep
is the thing that makes us
most human.
It's called your
prefrontal cortex.
And it takes a nosedive
like a dart into the ground
when you are under-slept.
- Mm-hmm. Empathy.
- Empathy,
rational decision making,
executive control,
regulation of our emotions.
Essentially, without a frontal
lobe, you're a two-year-old.
- And welcome to that.
- [laughs]
- You look great.
- Yeah.
- How are you staying
in shape these days?
- Well, that's Ozempic.
- Oh.
- GLP-1s were developed
to fight type 2 diabetes,
but a side effect
Tremendous weight loss
Caught the attention
of the rich and famous.
- Mounjaro that's what I use.
- Yeah.
- One opponent
I could not defeat.
- Celebs and wealthy people
started paying their way
to weight loss,
driving up the cost for those
who actually needed it.
And it ignited
a wider discussion
about the ethical
and social implication
of using these drugs
for appearance,
rather than medical necessity.
So I sat down with one of
the country's leading experts
on the matter,
Dr. David Kessler,
former FDA head
and himself a GLP-1 user,
and Dr. Supriya Rao,
who combines
a lifestyle-focused approach
with GLP-1 medications.
GLP-1s.
- Right.
- Highly effective.
- Landmark medication
of our lifetime.
- So every doctor
I talk to has said this.
It started off
as a rich person's thing.
Why was that a bad thing?
Or was it or not?
Because if celebrities you
know, there was lots of joking.
- The celebrity thing,
unfortunately, gave it a stigma
that people didn't want to be
on it, because they're like,
oh, you're on Ozempic
just to lose 5 pounds
or for cosmetic reasons to fit
into a dress for the Met Gala.
Whereas, for me, it's like,
all the other patients
who use it
for metabolic disease.
- Most things around weight
is thought of
as a willpower issue.
- These drugs work
through pharmacology.
They work through biology.
So they show us
this is not about willpower.
Go back thousands of years.
Our brains evolved
in an environment of scarcity.
Your ability to find food
was tied to your survival.
And all these circuits just
evolved
to find that highly caloric
density food.
- And so those hyperpalatable
foods
That fat, that sugar,
that salt
Hits those happy receptors
in our brain,
our dopamine that makes us
happy in that moment.
- And all these circuits
just evolved
so that we would survive
when there was no food around.
That worked in an environment
of scarcity.
It does not work
in an environment of abundance.
When you take fat,
sugar, and salt,
put it on every corner,
make it available 24-7,
all of a sudden, that
food noise comes into my head.
You're gonna seek out
that food and find it.
And then if I try to resist,
you see this craving.
When I had to study
for exams in med school
and I had to stay up
till 3:00 at night,
I used food that allowed me
to do that.
I would gain my weight,
and then I would lose it
repeatedly.
I've run government agencies.
I've been deans of med school.
I have discipline.
I couldn't control my weight.
- What these medications do
We're kind of artificially
allowing food to sit there
for a longer time
so you feel fuller longer.
You have the satiety cues
completed.
- Make you un-hungry.
- They get you to eat less.
- Eat less.
If even Dr. Kessler,
with medical training
and structure,
found it nearly impossible
to manage his weight
without GLP-1s,
what chance did
the average person ever have?
- I did every diet
that has been out since 1993,
since I had my kids
Jenny Craig, Weight Watchers,
LA Weight Loss.
There was an Army diet
that was about hot dogs.
Whatever, I did it.
- Yeah. Hot dogs?
- Yeah. It was a yo-yo
that kept going on and
- Cleo Laughlin,
a retired night-shift nurse,
spent decades waging
her own battle with weight.
- I was actually looking
for a psychiatrist,
thinking there was
something wrong with me
in the head that
was blocking me.
So I made the telephone call.
Next thing I know,
I had a nutritionist,
and she said, oh, we're
starting this new program.
It's basically a plant-based
diet and no processed foods.
And then at that point,
she also introduced me
to the GLP-1s.
- Cleo has lost 110 pounds.
In this case, GLP-1s
have been effective,
but the story isn't so simple.
- I wasn't a diabetic.
I didn't have
blood-pressure issues.
But I knew I was, like
a couple eyeblinks away from it.
And I didn't want to
come out of retirement
and be one of those
people that dropped dead
- Right.
- You know, a year later.
- To keep the weight off,
Cleo spent over $2,800
just last year
A huge expense
for a retired nurse.
- You know, when you go
and you get a medication
that costs $1,000
- Mm-hmm.
- And people who have
a lot of weight to lose,
they just need it,
they just need it.
It's the right thing to do.
It's part of keeping
America healthy.
I'm not saying
you have to make it free,
but make it affordable.
- Right.
- But I was listening where the
insurance company was saying,
this is going to bankrupt us
if we support these GLP-1s.
- Well, unless we bring the
prices down, which you can.
- Right.
Well, God forbid they do that.
- And a bigger concern
is long-term access,
and like many health decisions,
it doesn't just affect her
but the family
orbiting around her.
- Since I've known Cleo
35 years or so,
you know,
she never gave up on it.
And I had read a little bit
about the GLP-1 drugs.
I do think about, you know,
having to be on it, you know
- Long-term.
- Permanently, yeah
and what would happen
if you stopped taking it.
- Right.
- [chuckles] Go back to
[laughter]
Go back to the nightmare
two years ago.
[laughter]
- But we're in big trouble
as a country.
- Why is that?
- You have one industry making
billions of dollars, right,
that's making us sick
with what we're eating.
And you have another industry
that's making equal profits
trying to treat what that
former industry is doing.
Most people couldn't afford
that drug.
Health plans employers
looked at that and said,
I can't afford that.
- Even if it's saved
on the other end.
- Yeah, right, but employers
still think of it
almost as a cosmetic thing.
- Big news, America
Wegovy now comes in a pill.
- Recently, there's been
a lot of progress
in the GLP-1 world.
In early 2026,
a pill form was approved
that greatly reduced the price,
but access to better medication
doesn't automatically solve
the deeper
public-health challenge.
So you've compared it to
Big Tobacco in terms of
And that was defeated.
- Tobacco was the great
public-health success.
Obesity is the great
public-health failure.
We didn't change the cigarette.
We demonized the industry.
The problem is,
you can't demonize food.
- There's one group
that is pushing
against what you call
ultra-formulated foods
The MAHA movement.
The MAHA movement,
Make America Healthy Again,
championed by RFK, Jr.,
is pushing back
against GLP-1 drugs
by scrapping plans
for Medicare
and Medicaid coverage,
insisting that better diet
and exercise,
especially cutting out
ultra-processed foods,
are the real keys
to America's health crisis.
- Are you going to tell me
that they're gonna get rid
of all the McDonald's
and all of the fast food
- You saw the picture
of RFK, Jr. with McDonald's.
- So I'm a little dubious,
honestly.
You're working two jobs.
You're trying to make sure
your kids get to school.
You're trying to decide
what bill you have to pay.
So I think a lot
of Americans struggle
with being able to hit
all these different things
in their daily life.
All this other
lifestyle stuff just seems,
like, almost impossible.
- Extra.
- MAHA can't just be
for the wealthy.
Improving the quality
of our food is important,
but it won't matter if
the rest of the infrastructure
that's around
doesn't help everybody.
Like, trying to get rid
of GLP-1s is not the answer.
- While promising,
the long-term effects
of GLP-1 drugs
are still largely unknown.
The jury's out
on a lot of this stuff.
What's really critically
important here with GLP-1s
is we conduct studies
and we look at
the long-term effects of this,
because every single
medical intervention
has a downside.
And so it needs to be studied
in the population
over a long term.
That should be our goal.
- Abs tight.
Get it.
Get it. Get it.
- There are three clear things
we need for longevity
Eat well, good sleep,
and, of course, exercise.
- Yeah, keep going, keep going.
- Ooh!
- There you go. Yeah.
- Ow.
- Ow.
- It's inexpensive
and often free.
But the industry still finds
a way to make a buck.
This makes me slim
and girlish, right?
- Sure.
- I work out three times
a week with my trainer, J.,
mostly doing strength training.
[grunts]
But according to the Internet,
my current routine
isn't going to cut it.
All right, that's enough.
- [laughs]
- Girl, I done got me
a mini step machine,
and, yes, I am loving it.
- What I absolutely love
to use my vibration plate for
is to sit down on my plate.
- On the ground, step on.
I can literally do it
while watching Netflix.
- There have been
so many questionable
get-fit-quick products.
- What is VO2 max,
and how do you improve it?
- And something called
the VO2 max test
seems like it might be one
of those as well.
Luke, I am your father.
- You realize
no one can hear you?
This is like your nightmare.
- Ha ha. You are my nightmare.
The VO2 max test measures
how much oxygen your body
can use during intense exercise.
It's a real indicator for your
cardiovascular fitness
and longevity, not junk science.
You want me to do it
on the Apple Watch?
- Nah, that thing's
a piece of junk.
- Everyday wearables,
like Oura Rings, Fitbits,
and Apple Watches can give
you a VO2 max estimate,
but this uncomfortable test
gives you
a much more accurate reading.
- And then we're just
gonna periodically increase
the challenge.
[device beeping]
There you go.
After we get you your numbers
and we set your program up,
we'll be able to retest
in six to eight weeks
and see how effective
our program's been.
- If you increase your VO2 max
by just one point,
you can decrease, on average,
your risk of dying
from anything
Heart disease, stroke,
cancer, dementia by 10%.
VO2 max testing has been
around for a long time,
but there's been a recent
renewed interest,
as influencers
and fitness experts
publicly praise it
for longevity.
- The higher your VO2 max,
the greater health span
you have.
- Professional lab tests
at sports clinics
or high-end gyms run anywhere
from $100 to $250 a session.
And if you want to buy
your own VO2 max machine,
the range
from $5,000 to $30,000.
It's one more thing
you can spend money on
to give yourself
a supposed edge.
[rock music]
After two months of running
a few times a week,
I'm back to see
if there is any improvement.
Should there be an improvement?
- Oh, yes, definitely.
- What if there's not?
- No chance.
You ready?
- All right, let's go.
- Hold on tight.
[beeping]
♪
Just keep a nice, normal breath.
- [groans]
- This is like nothing.
It's almost downhill,
it's such a low incline.
Yeah.
I'll be nervous once
the fingers stop coming out.
- Guess what.
This 62-year-old got younger,
at least by VO2 max standards.
Whew!
- Look at all the way
down here we got some 37s.
- An average VO2 max
for women my age
would be somewhere
between 27 and 38.
Now I'm 37,
so the hard work paid off.
- Before, your heart rate
was 30 beats more a minute
- Wow.
- To process less oxygen
than you can now.
Now you're processing
37 milliliters.
So you're doing, you know,
almost a third more work
at the same heart rate.
- And that's purely
'cause I kept running,
'cause I trained my heart
to be more efficient.
- You trained your muscles
to more efficiently use oxygen.
- I see.
- You just become a stronger,
more efficient animal.
- So, "you're superior"
Say that to me.
- According to this laptop,
you are superior.
- Superior!
- Okay.
- Yeah.
This is good for me for sure,
but is it necessary?
What it is, is expensive
and probably not needed
for the masses.
Like sleep, people don't
need the bells and whistles
just to do the activity.
After testing out
the latest longevity trends,
one thing is clear
Most are either unproven,
marginally useful,
or wildly overpriced.
This is a family network.
- I do like how you still think
people can hear you.
- Mm.
VO2 max, sleep, and GLP-1 drugs
have solid evidence and impact
meaningful outcomes.
- I just feel good.
- My butt is really toasty.
- I know, really hot.
Red-light therapy
and hyperbaric chambers
may help in limited
medical contexts,
but as a consumer product,
they're mostly a luxury.
Sound or so-called
"vibe therapies"
offer relaxation.
- [snoring]
- But there's little proof
that they contribute
to longevity as yet.
- [snoring]
- If something suddenly
becomes really hot,
if you heard
about it on Instagram,
they may not be as accurate
as you might want.
If anyone says, this is
gonna change your life,
it's not gonna change your life.
Others are really promising
GLP-1s, for example.
Be a savvy consumer.
The bigger story is access.
If a longevity hack only works
if you're rich enough
to buy it,
it's not a breakthrough.
It's a lifestyle brand.
- It's, again,
branding exclusivity
- Right.
- Access.
So I think all of these things
come into play.
- Is that a satisfying way
to try to live longer?
- Um
- It feels exhausting.
- It feels really tiring, right?
- Mm-hmm.
- What are we supposed to do?
Plug stuff in that isn't
really, like, super tested?
- And no matter what you do,
you're gonna be dead someday.
- Yes.
The train has left the station,
and we're all on it.
And we're just trying
to make sense of it.
- Make it a better trip, right?
- [laughs] Yeah.